Greenstone

[tonykidd]

I was looking over some of my greenstone pieces and was marveling at the differences in colors and textures. This is a smooth mortar that feels as smooth as silk versus the rough greenstone celt. They were true craftsmen! Please post any greenstone relics; I'd love to see them.

View attachment 1411728

View attachment 1411729

View attachment 1411730

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

A History of Mining on the Kenai Peninsula, Alaska - Grab it through Amazon!

[tonykidd]

I'd be more inclined to say discoidal because of its size. IMO, it would take too much time to make it that nice for just a mortar. The Southern Cult sites often had discoidals found at them but they usually weren't interred at burials and were passed down from generation to generation. Cahokia interred some in burials and I'd have to research some of the other sites. Really nice stuff.

Is it the same on both sides or tapered on one side?

It is uniform, flat on the bottom and concave only on the top. It calipers to less than 1/100th of an inch symmetrically, which makes it one of my favorite pieces. It very well could be a discoidal, but it was found in a burial which led us to believe otherwise, just as you said. This particular group may not have prescribed to the belief in the exemption of discoidals from burials, but this is the only one we found in any case. This particular Indian had some very ornate things buried with him, including a number of pearl beads and copper implements, so he may have been fond of pretty things.
Good call on the discoidal theory!

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

A Handbook of Civil War Bullets and Cartridges - Grab it through Amazon!

[Mrdigz]

I was going to comment on the symmetry of the piece but you answered my question. Very impressive.
Also, If you have many more of the copper pieces then I probably would of had one cleaned myself just to see what it really would've looked like. Really Great stuff!!!

 

[monsterrack]

It is uniform, flat on the bottom and concave only on the top. It calipers to less than 1/100th of an inch symmetrically, which makes it one of my favorite pieces. It very well could be a discoidal, but it was found in a burial which led us to believe otherwise, just as you said. This particular group may not have prescribed to the belief in the exemption of discoidals from burials, but this is the only one we found in any case. This particular Indian had some very ornate things buried with him, including a number of pearl beads and copper implements, so he may have been fond of pretty things.
Good call on the discoidal theory!

I take form your post as you stated these items were found in a burial. Are you a state related agent? If not then it is against all laws in the USA to be digging in a burial and I would be very careful about saying so and posting it on the internet. Some collectors have lost everything for far less, some jail time. You have some nice stuff ,but I don't condone digging up a burial with out the state being present and with their blessings. It makes all collectors look like grave robbers when this done in the wrong way. I hope I am wrong on this matter, but JMO this should not be allowed on this site if it is done outside of the law.

 

[Mrdigz]

I take form your post as you sated these items were found in a burial. Are you a state related agent? If not then it is against all laws in the USA to be digging in a burial and I would be very careful about saying so and posting it on the internet. Some collectors have lost everything for far less, some jail time. You have some nice stuff ,but I don't condone digging up a burial with out the state being present and with their blessings. It makes all collectors look like grave robbers when this done in the wrong way. I hope I am wrong on this matter, but JMO this should not be allowed on this site if it is done outside of the law.

I agree 100%. I'm just assuming there was permission given to excavate from the burial site.
If there isn't a green light to excavate with papers to prove then I wouldn't even be in the vicinity of the site. And I would def not post about it. The Big Boys don't play around when it comes to that. Hopefully your all squared away and can continue excavating. Any chance of posting more artifacts from site?

 

[tonykidd]

I take form your post as you stated these items were found in a burial. Are you a state related agent? If not then it is against all laws in the USA to be digging in a burial and I would be very careful about saying so and posting it on the internet. Some collectors have lost everything for far less, some jail time. You have some nice stuff ,but I don't condone digging up a burial with out the state being present and with their blessings. It makes all collectors look like grave robbers when this done in the wrong way. I hope I am wrong on this matter, but JMO this should not be allowed on this site if it is done outside of the law.

Yes, this was all perfectly legal and documented. The original 6 burials we excavated on our own, then associated with the state to remove the remaining 24. It was very interesting, especially since there was a time constraint due to the land owner wanting to expand his workshop. He had begun removing the mound with a backhoe to use as fill dirt when a customer found some human bones and a copper celt in his yard. The owner of the mound allowed us to excavate, which we did until we decided to get the state involved due to complexity and lack of expertise. The owner was determined to remove every bit of the site from his property, so it was a very quick process. Once in a lifetime.

 

[The Grim Reaper]

It is uniform, flat on the bottom and concave only on the top. It calipers to less than 1/100th of an inch symmetrically, which makes it one of my favorite pieces. It very well could be a discoidal, but it was found in a burial which led us to believe otherwise, just as you said. This particular group may not have prescribed to the belief in the exemption of discoidals from burials, but this is the only one we found in any case. This particular Indian had some very ornate things buried with him, including a number of pearl beads and copper implements, so he may have been fond of pretty things.
Good call on the discoidal theory!

I too hope this was a state sanctioned dig of this burial. If not then the mods need to remove everything posted here.

 

[jmaschal]

Pretty cool to be a part of something like that. I am sure you learned a lot. Any pics of the excavation process?

 

[tonykidd]

Pretty cool to be a part of something like that. I am sure you learned a lot. Any pics of the excavation process?

It was years ago-before cellphones- but I'm sure I have some decent pictures somewhere. I'll have to figure out a way to scan them and still retain any clarity at all. We used a lot of Polaroids then and lost a boatload to age.

 

[jmaschal]

Thanks would love to see them.

 

[arrow86]

It was years ago-before cellphones- but I'm sure I have some decent pictures somewhere. I'll have to figure out a way to scan them and still retain any clarity at all. We used a lot of Polaroids then and lost a boatload to age.

So this isn't the same site as all the other pics you have been posting? You have come across 2 once in a lifetime sites? I thought you posted a bowl sticking out of a bank that you were in the process of excavating.

 

[tonykidd]

So this isn't the same site as all the other pics you have been posting? You have come across 2 once in a lifetime sites? I thought you posted a bowl sticking out of a bank that you were in the process of excavating.

These are two different sites. I wouldn't necessarily say the one with the bowl is once in a lifetime, but the first one certainly was. The bowl is literally sitting under an 8" tree stump in a logging furrow about 12" high. Excavation isn't the proper word, since that would actually involve some effort. I just want to make sure someone is with me when I take it out so we can document it. The opportunity to excavate burials has passed, never mind being able to keep or collect the artifacts. I recognize that I have been blessed and truly appreciate it. I'm sure there are many more discoveries to be made and hope I have the opportunity to be involved.

 

[Bow Only]

I was involved with Calvin when he started the Lake Jackson excavations. I used some of that information in my science project as it pertained to inland Ft Walton period sites.

 

[monsterrack]

To be fair, it wasn't found with the other greenstone I posted earlier. The greenstone celt and the two greenstone atlatl weights came from one site, and this one came from another. The colors and textures vary wildly. It was obviously ceremonial, because it was with these and some other cool items:

View attachment 1411893

View attachment 1411895

The copper chisels look like a type that was found on the north end of Creighton Island Ga. and the eagle plate looks close to some found near Malden Mo. designs of this kind represent the SE ceremonial complex. As it was posted before I would never have had them cleaned that good, but to each his on. This would have been a Nat. Geo. find !!!!!!

 

[rock]

@ Tonykidd if you want to start a new thread for Green Stone artifacts that would be fine with me I have a couple I have found but dont really want to add them to this one. Lets start over.