Found In My Yard

[RPG]

OK...Last whatsit today. It's 50 deg outside and I think I will go MD'ing. This was found in my front yard
and I have found 5 in all. 1 1/8" long and slotted on one end. Maybe a part of a stringed instrument of
some sort? My house was built around 1900 but I think there was a house there before. There is an iron
patch about 30 yards from my doorstep. Square nails, heater parts and horse shoes. I am told my house
never had a heater. It was heated with a fireplace. Any help will be appreciated.
Randy

 

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[lostcauses]

I am almost positive it is part of the armature from a starter for a car, truck ,tractor ect. There is a row of the going around one end of the armature I would guess around 20 in all.

BINGO.

I think you got this one..

 

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[72cheyenne]

I am almost positive it is part of the armature from a starter for a car, truck ,tractor ect. There is a row of the going around one end of the armature I would guess around 20 in all.

I think you may be right also. I was actually thinking last night that they may be from an armature of some sort of electric motor. After all the copper winding is removed, you get left with these pieces, minus the shaft of coarse.

 

[Monty]

I don't remember if I photographed them or not, but I'll check. I know I didn't physically keep them. I'm on a borrowed computer out of town but I will check when I get back home Fri. or Sat. if an ID hasn't been made. Monty

 

[lostcauses]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commutator_(electric)
Gets folks a good idea of this..

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commutator_(electric)
Gets folks a good idea of this..

link does not display.

 

[72cheyenne]

Ok I've look at all kinds of armature, rotors, etc. I'm gonna go back on what I said earlier about thinking it might be from one of these. From what I can tell....the piece that you would wrap the windings around is always one piece, or many thin stamped out pieces pressed together. Unless these are from some very early electric motor example...I'm gonna say they are not part of a starter, generator, alternator, electric motor, etc. Back to searching.

 

[lostcauses]

Strange, try this again


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commutator_(electric)

well this does not work.. Nuts..
Try this

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php...rch=Commutator&fulltext=Search&ns0=1&redirs=0
Go down to Comutator_(electric)

 

[72cheyenne]

Try this link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commutator_(electric) . I think the pieces in question would have to be more machined looking to be a part of an armature.

Sorry about the link. When you copy and paste it, it leaves off the last parenthesis

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Is this the pic you were looking at? Are they slightly curved?

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Ring/Segment Construction

Cross-section of a commutator that can be disassembled for repair.[1]A commutator typically consists of a set of copper segments, fixed around part of the circumference of the rotating part of the machine (the rotor), and a set of spring-loaded brushes fixed to the stationary frame of the machine. The external source of current (for a motor) or electrical load (for a generator) is connected to the brushes. For small equipment the commutator segments can be stamped from sheet metal. For very large equipment the segments are made from a copper casting that is then machined into the final shape.

Each conducting segment on the armature of the commutator is insulated from adjacent segments. Initially when the technology was first developed, mica was used as an insulator between commutation segments. Later materials research into polymers brought the development of plastic spacers which are more durable and less prone to cracking, and have a higher and more uniform breakdown voltage than mica.

The segments are held onto the shaft using a dovetail shape on the edges or underside of each segment, using insulating wedges around the perimeter of each commutation segment. Due to the high cost of repairs, for small appliance and tool motors the segments are typically crimped permanently in place and cannot be removed; when the motor fails it is simply discarded and replaced. On very large industrial motors it is economical to be able to replace individual damaged segments, and so the end-wedge can be unscrewed and individual segments removed and replaced.

Commutator segments are connected to the coils of the armature, with the number of coils (and commutator segments) depending on the speed and voltage of the machine. Large motors may have hundreds of segments.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commutator_(electric)

 

[RPG]

Well, I think we are on the right track here. I just need to find the right pic. I am beginning to think they are something electical, but what.
bigcy...they are not rounded on top but flat. Very crudely made, not machined. No two exactly alike. But if you stack them together they
start to form a circle. The slots in the end look like where a wire could have been attached (soldered?) I will clean in peroxide and see if any wire remains in the slot. I am going to be on vacation in a few weeks and will search for more. If this is from a commutator there will be more.
Randy

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Well, I think we are on the right track here. I just need to find the right pic. I am beginning to think they are something electical, but what.
bigcy...they are not rounded on top but flat. Very crudely made, not machined. No two exactly alike. But if you stack them together they
start to form a circle. The slots in the end look like where a wire could have been attached (soldered?) I will clean in peroxide and see if any wire remains in the slot. I am going to be on vacation in a few weeks and will search for more. If this is from a commutator there will be more.
Randy

BINGO. I think oldsledz and lostcauses got it! Go back and look at the pic. 1)-They are copper segments flat on top. 2)-One end has a notch. 3)-It has the "dovetail" bottom. And most important 4)- they start to form a circle. That is what I meant by "slightly curved". Yes there should be more. Also look for thin strips of mica that would be inserted between the copper segments. I think this is solved and I am impressed. I think they are early copper commutator segments.

 

[72cheyenne]

They must be early ones. Most that I have seen, at least fairly modern ones, are machine pretty accurate. Of coarse years in the ground can take its toll on anything.....so if thats what they are, I'll buy into it. Now go find the rest of them and reconstruct this thing!

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

They must be early ones. Most that I have seen, at least fairly modern ones, are machine pretty accurate. Of coarse years in the ground can take its toll on anything.....so if thats what they are, I'll buy into it. Now go find the rest of them and reconstruct this thing!

Yes they usually are machined pretty accurate. But reading about the early ones with the mica in between the segments sounds kinda crude. His also has the dovetail bottom as described in the text. When he said they "start to form a circle" convinced me.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

As far as finding more, the text says: "On very large industrial motors it is economical to be able to replace individual damaged segments, and so the end-wedge can be unscrewed and individual segments removed and replaced". These may have been damaged, replaced and discarded.

 

[lostcauses]

Now lets see them heater parts, so we might figure what these were used on...

 

[oldsledz]

Chances are the starter or generator this came out of was burned and tore apart to get the copper out of it to sell for scrap. That may be why they look crude and not perfectly matched, they may not have all came out of the same item. I have scraped out a bunch of them.

 

[RPG]

Just found this picture. Kinda fuzzy but you can see the slots in the end. this one is a little longer but looks the same. It's the commutator out of a 1928 Model A Ford. I am convinced. I am sure I will find more when I go back in a couple of weeks. Thanks for the great research you guys did on this.
Randy

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Just found this picture. Kinda fuzzy but you can see the slots in the end. this one is a little longer but looks the same. It's the commutator out of a 1928 Model A Ford. I am convinced. I am sure I will find more when I go back in a couple of weeks. Thanks for the great research you guys did on this.
Randy

great pic. It was a combined TN effort.

 

[RPG]

Just found this picture. Kinda fuzzy but you can see the slots in the end. this one is a little longer but looks the same. It's the commutator out of a 1928 Model A Ford. I am convinced. I am sure I will find more when I go back in a couple of weeks. Thanks for the great research you guys did on this.
Randy

great pic. It was a combined TN effort.

Well bigcy...I think we can mark this one solved. What do you think? 8)