Early Enginners Button?

[cwdigger]

Any ideas on this button it was found more than a mile back in the woods at an early colonial site

 

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[Getty]

ok heres mine. It weighs 3.2 grams. It is flat as a coin.I was thinking that it looks like yours was "pryed/picked" out of whatever it belongs to.I definately want to see an end to this mystery piece.just micrometered mine at 22.5 mm. hope this helps.

 

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[Bigcypresshunter]

ok heres mine. It weighs 3.2 grams. It is flat as a coin.I was thinking that it looks like yours was "pryed/picked" out of whatever it belongs to.I definately want to see an end to this mystery piece.just micrometered mine at 22.5 mm. hope this helps.

If yours is flat then yes I think the convex shape was caused by the prying out, like a freeze plug. Because there are so many, Im guessing that this has to be pryed out to make use of the item.

So far 3 pics. 2-pryed/convex; 1-flat. Can you determine the date range from other items found?

 

[Getty]

ok heres mine. It weighs 3.2 grams. It is flat as a coin.I was thinking that it looks like yours was "pryed/picked" out of whatever it belongs to.I definately want to see an end to this mystery piece.just micrometered mine at 22.5 mm. hope this helps.

If yours is flat then yes I think the convex shape was caused by the prying out, like a freeze plug. Because there are so many, Im guessing that this has to be pryed out to make use of the item.

So far 3 pics. 2-pryed/convex; 1-flat. Can you determine the date range from other items found?

Mine was dug at a house built in 1700s.Till I got the dirt off of it, I thought it was a colonial copper.Rinsed in the creek and it was this "disc".

 

[cwdigger]

hmmm now thats 5 from very early sites, could be somesort of piece of farm equipment, but Im still not sure

 

[Getty]

hmmm now thats 5 from very early sites, could be somesort of piece of farm equipment, but Im still not sure

Im still not convinced that its not part of a two piece button or part of a rossette possible (farrier related). Still searchin here.I dug a doubletree ring and another iron (horse related) ring on the same property.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

hmmm now thats 5 from very early sites, could be somesort of piece of farm equipment, but Im still not sure

Im still not convinced that its not part of a two piece button or part of a rossette possible (farrier related). Still searchin here.I dug a doubletree ring and another iron (horse related) ring on the same property.

I dont think 2 piece buttons were invented until about 1840 I think. Someone verify.

If it were a 2 piece button, I would think someone would find a complete one.

 

[Getty]

hmmm now thats 5 from very early sites, could be somesort of piece of farm equipment, but Im still not sure

Im still not convinced that its not part of a two piece button or part of a rossette possible (farrier related). Still searchin here.I dug a doubletree ring and another iron (horse related) ring on the same property.

I dont think 2 piece buttons were invented until about 1840 I think. Someone verify.

If it were a 2 piece button, I would think someone would find a complete one.

sorry i misworded,not necessarily a (button), but a two piece item.i dont know how to show what i mean,but it could be from 1800s though.my site was built in 1700s and still standing, alot of room for items lost

 

[cwdigger]

It could be some sort of roosette, like many bit boses used during the CW some were two piece with the center "US" pressed in, this could be something similiar, just not from that period. Gotta be an answer somewhere, I have searched and searched and still come up empty handed

 

[Getty]

It could be some sort of roosette, like many bit boses used during the CW some were two piece with the center "US" pressed in, this could be something similiar, just not from that period. Gotta be an answer somewhere, I have searched and searched and still come up empty handed

Im empty too.I did look further with mag glass for some sort of wear mark around the edges, but nothing. Could be something that was simply one piece.

 

[Breezie]

I've got to agree with DaRoofa & Don in that it is related to Empire, and I think it's some type of company logo plaque that was on farm equipment; possibly an old wooden plow or the likes. Interesting find, Breezie

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Im not disagreeing with anybody but didnt someone say they found several together? That doesnt sound like a company logo fell off.

 

[umrgolf]

Im not disagreeing with anybody but didnt someone say they found several together? That doesnt sound like a company logo fell off.

I found 3 while I was in VA... One was at a colonial site in VA Beach and colonial all the way up to 1900's was found, 2nd I don't remember exactly where I found it .. 3rd and last I found in Hampton in a yard that gave up CW all the way thru 1900's stuff as well.

 

[IronSpike]

I agree the odds are good that this item will be ID'ed.

It reminds me of an 'E' piece I once found:

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,222247.0.html

It may have been encased in leather so I think Daroofa's 1880's Eberhard Saddlery is an interesting suggestion

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

This is a toughie. Ill bet Buckleboy found one too.

 

[cwdigger]

This is a toughie. Ill bet Buckleboy found one too.

Alot of things close but nothing exact, I bet you are right bigcypresshunter I bet will has found some to.

 

[BuckleBoy]

I've never found one of these, but finding them at old sites makes sense for just about any whatzit we might find. Old sites are where we look, LOL. So of course we'll find our whatzits there. In other words, the sites being "old" for all these "E" thingys ain't coincidence.

I once thought the whatzits I was digging (later ID'ed as scythe handle ferrules) were some sort of CW find because I kept finding them in CW camps and picket posts. Thing is, I was mainly digging in CW sites.

I have a hunch that folks are on the right track with tool/horse/farm-related on this one. It looks nothing like a button except that it is round. Not certain we'll get an ID on this, but I am looking too. Whatever it was, it is widespread--so again, probably tool/horse/farm-related. And certainly not military.

Cheers,


Buck

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Penniesmine found another in CW area. It appears to have a kink. http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php?topic=382780.new#new

 

[TheCannonballGuy]

I have four. One is flat, the other three are low-convex. One I dug near Fredericksburg (in the woods), the others I obtained fron relic-hunters' junkboxes.

Because the "pry mark" on them is the same size and same shape, repeatedly, I don't think it's a pry-mark.

I'd like to comment about the form (or as it's called nowadays, font) of the letter. A general rule of thimb regarding letters stamped into metal is that in the civil war era and earlier, most had "serifs" ...the little prongs on the arms of a letter. "Plain" letters become much more frequent after the civil war ended. For example, the lettering on almost every pre-1866 button backmark has serifs. Then in the Indian Wars era, you start seeing lots of "plain-letter" backmarks. So, a useful tip to remember is that if a button's backmark has "plain" lettering it's almost certainly Indian Wars era or later.

The rule-of-thumb about "plain" letters is generally true with the lettering on US coins.

I think the change is related to the cost of a skilled diemaker's labor. Fancy lettering is more costly to do than "plain" lettering.

So to me, at least, the "plain" letter E on these discs is an indication that it was made in the latter 1800s, if not later.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I'd like to comment about the form (or as it's called nowadays, font) of the letter. A general rule of thimb regarding letters stamped into metal is that in the civil war era and earlier, most had "serifs" ...the little prongs on the arms of a letter. "Plain" letters become much more frequent after the civil war ended. For example, the lettering on almost every pre-1866 button backmark has serifs. Then in the Indian Wars era, you start seeing lots of "plain-letter" backmarks. So, a useful tip to remember is that if a button's backmark has "plain" lettering it's almost certainly Indian Wars era or later.

The rule-of-thumb about "plain" letters is generally true with the lettering on US coins.

I think the change is related to the cost of a skilled diemaker's labor. Fancy lettering is more costly to do than "plain" lettering.

So to me, at least, the "plain" letter E on these discs is an indication that it was made in the latter 1800s, if not later.

Very good observation on the letter font. I have WWI buttons with the old font but the serifs pretty much disappeared by WWII. This looks like a 20th century item. But that makes it even more mysterious. I wonder if any 2 were ever found together?

 

[umrgolf]

Penniesmine found another in CW area. It appears to have a kink. http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php?topic=382780.new#new

Lol , i didnt know Alan found one of these.. Used to dig with him all the time when I was stationed in SC.. Seems they pop up all over the east coast in singular form