Disturbed ground density detector

[bc1]

Hello guys. I'm new here and am looking at buying a good metal detector. About the top of my budget is a Whites v3i, minelab safari, or maybe a minelab etrac.

Here is the deal. I am in Kansas and work with primarily heavy clay soils and then the sand hills. I would be doing relic hunting around farmsteads, old campsites, and along the Santa Fe Trail. Probably most of what I will see will be iron and maybe an occasional coin. This would be in large plowed wheat fields, pastures, and along creeks which means covering a large area.

However the really main thing I want to do is for historical research to find disturbed ground such as old foundations, graves, holes, former foundations, etc. and then I also want to find compacted dense ground caused by wagon wheel and ox/mule hooves on the Santa Fe Trail.

I have this idea that by adjusting the ground discriminator or whatever it is for regular soil, I can make it show compacted ground such as walking perpendicular to the old trail/road ruts. The same goes for finding old building sites, and military campgrounds where they had buildings for a few years and then dug latrines, etc. Also a common thing they did was dig dugouts into the side of creek banks, rifle pits, and so on.

I would like to have a ground penetrating radar but I can't afford that. I have this idea that a programmable one such as the v3i or the minelabs would allow me to program the discriminator part of the electronics to find soil that is either denser or less dense and work my way around it. Another thing I would use it for is to find buried pipe and electric lines as well as survey stakes.

I know a douser who can find the same things but I need something more scientific to follow up on and maybe confirm what he sees. I can find water lines dousing with brazing rods but that is it.

I have some bux saved up now but I thought I better ask before wasting a bunch of dough and buy the wrong one. Thanks for your help.

 

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[bc1]

Hello again. Here is what I know so far. I have talked to two people at kellyco. One briefly said it would not work and one said it would. I went to the local White's shop and he said he would not work because the metal detectors look for mineralization and loose or compacted soil in the same area would have the same mineralization so it wouldn't discriminate based on density of the soil. Then he said some areas around here have alkaline soil and the detector picks that up because it picks up saltwater. Not sure I would classify salt as a mineral but maybe it is. Thanks so far.

 

[Fletch88]

"Along creeks" I would probably get the ATPro. For $600 it's the best value in a machine for freshwater creeks and type of hunting you're wanting to do. Not sure about all the ground stuff you were trying to explain regarding wagon trails, but just starting digging targets and you can usually find nails, bricks, melted metals, etc to locate old homesites. If you don't want to get over knee deep in water the X-Terra 505 or 705 would be my choice because if the added features over the ATPro. (Threshold, All Metal mode, better audio IMO, backlight & prospecting mode(705 only-good compliment to coin mode when relic hunting), you can change frequencies by changing coils specific to area and type of hunting, and the Xterra is lighter with better balance. There are many different midrange machines these are just 3 I have used and have experience with.

 

[Rob in KS]

Howdy neighbor,
I don't think that you would be able to determine soil density with any of those detectors. As far as hunting relics and old farmsteads, even the cheapest detector should do the job. I started out looking for meteorites in farm fields. Most of my finds have been a foot or less. I have a home built PI detector. It will see plenty deep. The deepest thing I've found was a tractor oil filter at 2 feet buried in a terrace. I've wanted to hunt the Santa Fe trail but I've been lacking funds for travel expenses.

I assume that you've studied KS history and Santa Fe trail history. I can point you to a ton of reading material if you want.

Most of my finds are 20th century farm stuff. One of my older finds was a snaffle bit. It came about a mile north of the trail at the edge of a wheat field. It is way more rusted than my usual finds so I think it is much older.

I live a short drive north of this site.

and west of the bridge is a place on ****** creek where the United States Commissioners, while surveying the trail, met the chiefs of the Kansa Indians in council on the 16th day of August, 1825 under a large spreading oak in a small grove of trees. This was the only grove of trees seen for miles.

Send me a message and lets talk further

 

[bc1]

Hello. Rob you must be around McPherson where I'm at. If you are acquainted with the SFTA and the Quivira chapter then you know who I am. I was the one behind putting up the National Park Service SFT local tour signs through McPherson, Rice, and Barton Counties. Have also put together a number of brochures regarding trail sites in the area and have put on a number of programs. I've narrowed down the treaty site to 3 possible locations and they are west of the bridge on the blacktop. South of the road is my first choice. I would hit the lottery before finding a relic from the 1825 meeting but I'm sure it was a regular Kaw camping site.

I still have to decide on a metal detector but would like a multi frequency one with a good quality coil.

I have been researching the ground penetrating radar and that is out of the price range. Read some stuff about making one. They are radio frequency based but they are also based on electromagnetic fields and bouncing radio waves through the air/ground and the speed they bounce back to a receiver tell you the range etc. It all seems to me that the differing soil densities also changes the magnetic field of the soil which a metal detector looking for mineralization should find also such as in a hole that was dug. I've also learned that west of me there is a lot of alkalai soil which basically acts like a salt water beach when using a metal detector.

 

[Rob in KS]

It is so nice to talk with someone who knows about the history of the trail. I threw that bit about the Kaw treaty site to see how knowledgeable you were. The snaffle bit was from a field south of that site. It is very exciting to find someone who knows more than I do. Yes, I'm in NW MP county.

As to detectors, Most of the things I find in the fields around here are iron. My PI detectors love iron. Some of the coin shooting detectors have large iron rejection built in. I have a Tesoro,made for coin shooting, I ran it over a log chain and it didn't make a sound. Great if you are looking for coins but not so good for relics. A guy from a water district bought a bounty hunter to try to find water meters. It too has large iron rejection. It wouldn't sound on a meter cover.

Since I'm a nerd, I looked at building GPR. It's hard. You have to measure nano seconds. You are right, they measure soil densities. I understand that reading the results aren't easy either. You have to grid the area precisely. I've thought about building a flux gate magnatometer but I have no money.

About my homebuilt PI, I modified the circuit so I could run a large coil. Its a 3 foot coil on wheels. If the ground isn't too rough it works great. I can cover a lot of ground. It will see as deep as you want to dig. The other one is built on an old Garrett detector and has a 10", a 3" and a pinpointer coil. My young niece asked me once if I ever find anything. I laughed and said I always find something, but I don't always find something good. You would be surprised how much iron is way out in the fields far away from anything.

 

[shawninNY]

Get a machine, if it beeps Dig It! Welcome

 

[enamel7]

Salt is a mineral.

 

[augoldminer]

Make a couple probe rods.
A 4 foot and 8 foot out of hard 1/4 inch steel.

I had a couple metal detector targets i did not understand over the years. both i probed for and found they were large deep targets.

One turned out to be a 5 inch rocket warhead at 4 feet and the other turned out to be a large lead block at 5 feet.

I still don't understand how the lead block got buried that deep or why it was buried.

 

[boogeyman]

One good tool believe it or not is Google earth. The price is right! With the better & better imagery you'd be surprised what you can see in an area. Don't forget to use the imagery history tool also. I've found numerous abandoned sites using just GE. Sometimes it's easier to spot foundations and dug spots in the old imagery. Also, if a structure shows on the old imagery but not on the current, bet it's a good spot to at least do a cursory eyeball search.