CEDAR COUNTY MISSOURI WAR CACHE LOST

[gldhntr]

Church Hollow was a small rural community with a church, a mill,
and a few houses located in a hollow with Cedar Creek to the west and
the Sac River to the east. In the early part of the Civil War three friends
from Church Hollow joined the Confederate Army, but before leaving
their homes they pooled their money and then they put the money into
a large kettle. The kettle full of money was so heavy that two men had
to carry and bury it. A rough stone map of a kettle was carved on a rock
with several symbols carved on other rocks. The three then left for the
war.

On August 10, 1861, at the Battle of Wilson's Creek, just southwest
of Springfield, Missouri, one of the three was killed and another died
a few days later. The survivor later returned home, but his mind was
so affected by the war that his recollections of the past were hazy and
fragmented. His friends helped him search for the kettle of money, but
they never could locate it. He said the kettle was "30 minutes east of
the church."

 

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[Bugoutbusman]

Church hollow

If it were me, there's a lot of car dealerships between Osceola and Boliver and in Stockton. I'd go online and then call them... pick out what you want that they have on the lot...Inventory is online and they will either deliver a car or truck to you or come get you to go to the lot for purchase and make the inspection of your bus part of the deal...to have a mechanic come inspect it, call insurance tomorrow and renew and you're ready to go get tags.

If the mechanics at the dealerships don't inspect/repair buses...Have Scott's RV's in Lowry City do it. I know they can and so can Wilder at 13 and 52.

Or, Leave that bus as it is for now and just buy the vehicle, have it brought to you....deal with the owner or finance manager only working out purchase details. In Missouri it has to pass inspection before selling to anyone, even used vehicles. Go get tags within 30days. You'll have a 30day temp tag to drive anywhere after you get insurance.

It's easy and down there, those folks are always happy to please. You'll be on the road tomorrow. They all are probably closed or close early today for the Holiday.

Kace

I am from another state. Ive lived in my buses for years. My drivers license has also expired. To get registration here i need an address, then as far as inspe tion goes i cant drive the bus anywhere to get inspected. Theres so much red tape because its a converted bus from out of state and literally everything is expired. I have a friend that lives in Branson west that i see on weekends, he has a truck, i will arrange a trip with him to get the kettle inspected. Depending on how this goes i may just give both of these buses to the land owner here and walk away to buy everything new. However, i built these buses and id like to keep them, but i do need to get out of here.
My bus has 1 blown airbag, it will drive but it leans when air ride is up. It wont pass inspection until its repaired also

 

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[Bugoutbusman]

JUST TO LET EVERYONE KNOW, MY GOLD IS IN A SAFE LOCATION, COMING HERE TO ROB ME WONT END WELL FOR ANYONE.

 

[lairmo]

JUST TO LET EVERYONE KNOW, MY GOLD IS IN A SAFE LOCATION, COMING HERE TO ROB ME WONT END WELL FOR ANYONE.

Ok everyone it's in the airbag...lol

 

[creskol]

JUST TO LET EVERYONE KNOW, MY GOLD IS IN A SAFE LOCATION, COMING HERE TO ROB ME WONT END WELL FOR ANYONE.

Just for curiosity sake, assuming you do have the gold, how would you ever cash it in or sell it without raising suspicion?

 

[Bugoutbusman]

Church hollow

Just for curiosity sake, assuming you do have the gold, how would you ever cash it in or sell it without raising suspicion?

Im not exactly sure. I would guess 1 coin at a time. But i believe even then the paper trail would stack up. US govt has ALWAYS been after gold...and now oil.

The civil war was STARTED over Morril Tarrif tax NOT SLAVERY.
Tax went from 20% to 47% because confederates were finding spaniard caches and the union wanted thier cut.
The union CAPITALIZED on slavery to regain favor and support to overtake the KGC.
We are taught that confederates were going to invade mexico and make a large circle of slavery. LIES
KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE were after spaniard caches that formed that circle.
Yes they had slaves but they were invading over the gold caches.
Since then... govt has outlawed gold, confiscated gold, issued worthless war bonds, etc.
Only a few of the confederates were KGC.
The civil war was a govt takeover of the KGC...now called illuminate.
The civil war never ended, only the bullets stopped.
North/south, demonrats/republican....the war continues economicly/politically.
Our govt does ALL IT CAN to take our money, taxes, fees, fines, bailouts...its all rigged.

I AM NOT A CONFEDERATE SUPPORTER. I HATE SLAVERY LIKE EVERYONE ELS. BUT TRUTH IS TRUTH.
The govt wants ALL THE GOLD, and they lie about the civil war because they dont want people to know theres alot more out there to be found. Spaniards marked it plainly because indians didnt want useless heavy shiney rocks.

Im probably starting another debate over this post, but its the truth

 

[Bugoutbusman]

Church hollow

Wilsons creek was the 2nd battle of the civil war.
James Cawthon and James Cawthorn are the same man, he was 1st sherriff of cedar county. The colonel spelt his name differently in his signatures on his land deeds and his military records because there were a few kgc that changed to the union side ane he got exposed.
Nathaniel lyonns knew exactly who they were and where to find them...they were nearly surrounded on oak hill.
These 3 men had found a large spaniard cache...but only cashed in a very little...thats what was in the full kettle.
Running thier mouth about the big cache is what started it all.
Had these 3 men survived the battle the war would likely ended differently. These men had the funding for the civil war PLUS invasion of mexico.
The confederates knew THE SOUTH SHALL RISE AGAIN...because they thought other kgc knew where the cache was.

 

[Bugoutbusman]

The big cache is big enough to build "A WALL"
Id LOVE to be the guy to build the wall, but not 1 dime would go towards it or our economy, it would ALL go to politicians.
We just sent more than double the cost of the wall to HONDURAS...and now another caravan is coming.
i wont discuss the big cache any further

 

[Kace]

I am from another state. Ive lived in my buses for years. My drivers license has also expired. To get registration here i need an address, then as far as inspe tion goes i cant drive the bus anywhere to get inspected. Theres so much red tape because its a converted bus from out of state and literally everything is expired. I have a friend that lives in Branson west that i see on weekends, he has a truck, i will arrange a trip with him to get the kettle inspected. Depending on how this goes i may just give both of these buses to the land owner here and walk away to buy everything new. However, i built these buses and id like to keep them, but i do need to get out of here.
My bus has 1 blown airbag, it will drive but it leans when air ride is up. It wont pass inspection until its repaired also

There's at least 3 MOBILE RV/Bus mechanics down there besides the RV dealership mechanics who can do inspections after it's fixed...They come to you. With all the lakes and RV parks around there, No Problems on Bus or RV issues and they are very reasonable. One of them even fixed my old Pepsi machine since he did AC work and knew how. $20. He was there already, but that's all he charged for it.

When you're ready to fix everything when it's warmer, I highly recommend going to Colaw's in Joplin for parts if you are mechanical. They are an RV salvage yard that carries bus parts too. They also have new stuff but at deeply discounted prices. They even Pull the Parts off their units that you drive around in a golf cart, write down what you want from the number on the unit and then they load it for you. Great Place!

I'd forget getting that bus on the road right now.

Have your friend take you to get a Drivers License before the pot authentication.
Pick out a car online from one of the dealerships in the area...or in Branson since you have a friend there.
Call them, tell them which one you want. Inventory is online.
They will deliver it to your location and All Paperwork and Payment Can Be Done There. Normally two people come out to drive their other car back when there's no trade in. The finance manager or dealership owner will probably be one of the people that will come out.

I'm assuming you are paying cash from your posts so talk to the Dealership Owner or Finance Manager Only about it. They understand many people in those areas pay cash for vehicles, so it's No Big Deal and they don't ask questions about it. That's farm and cattle country... cash is readily welcomed unlike some other places.
Use your friends address and then change it when your 30day tag expires and you register it permanently if you want.

They will deliver the vehicle anywhere you want within reason...100miles if you don't want anyone coming to your bus.

Get insurance on the vehicle the day you get it. Have the insurance card sent to your phone in case you are pulled over and all mailings sent to a PO Box or to your friends place.

Tag it permanently within 30days for 2yrs.

Done.

You can be legal and on the road by Friday at the latest.

Pick an authenticator and appraiser.

Or... Since that pot is enamelware/cookware, you might call the Arabia Steamboat Museum in KC and ask for one of the Hawley family who they recommend since many of the things on that ship fall into that category. It sank in 1856. Was found, recovered by 3 families that were friends and other friends helped. They were treasure hunters. It has the largest collection of pre civil war artifacts in the world and All of the stuff was authenticated, appraised and is on display.

It's a great place to visit...if you go and If you don't find a similar pot there, very close to that location are reputable galleries with the type of access to the professional help you need to get the authentication and appraisal. You normally don't just walk in...make an appointment.

Kace

 

[lairmo]

There's at lease 3 MOBILE RV/Bus mechanics down there besides the RV dealership mechanics who can do inspections after it's fixed...They come to you. With all the lakes and RV parks around there, No Problems on Bus or RV issues and they are very reasonable. One of them even fixed my old Pepsi machine since he did AC work and knew how. $20. He was there already, but that's all he charged for it.

When you're ready to fix everything when it's warmer, I highly recommend going to Colaw's in Joplin for parts if you are mechanical. They are an RV salvage yard that carries bus parts too. They also have new stuff but at deeply discounted prices. They even Pull the Parts off their units that you drive around in a golf cart, write down what you want from the number on the unit and then they load it for you. Great Place!

I'd forget getting that bus on the road right now.

Have your friend take you to get a Drivers License before the pot authentication.
Pick out a car online from one of the dealerships in the area...or in Branson since you have a friend there.
Call them, tell them which one you want. Inventory is online.
They will deliver it to your location and All Paperwork and Payment Can Be Done There. Normally two people come out to drive their other car back when there's no trade in. The finance manager or dealership owner will probably be one of the people that will come out.

I'm assuming you are paying cash from your posts so talk to the Dealership Owner or Finance Manager Only about it. They understand many people in those areas pay cash for vehicles, so it's No Big Deal and they don't ask questions about it. That's farm and cattle country... cash is readily welcomed unlike some other places.
Use your friends address and then change it when your 30day tag expires and you register it permanently if you want.

They will deliver the vehicle anywhere you want within reason...100miles if you don't want anyone coming to your bus.

Get insurance on the vehicle the day you get it. Have the insurance card sent to your phone in case you are pulled over and all mailings sent to a PO Box or to your friends place.

Tag it permanently within 30days for 2yrs.

Done.

You can be legal and on the road by Friday at the latest.

Pick an authenticator and appraiser.

Or... Since that pot is enamelware/cookware, you might call the Arabia Steamboat Museum in KC and ask for one of the Hawley family who they recommend since many of the things on that ship fall into that category. It sank in 1856. Was found, recovered by 3 families that were friends and other friends helped. They were treasure hunters. It has the largest collection of pre civil war artifacts in the world and All of the stuff was authenticated, appraised and is on display.

It's a great place to visit...if you go and If you don't find a similar pot there, very close to that location are reputable galleries with the type of access to the professional help you need to get the authentication and appraisal. You normally don't just walk in...make an appointment.

Kace

Living in a Colaw rv as we speak...since my house burned....

 

[Kace]

Living in a Colaw rv as we speak...since my house burned....

That's a great place for RV'rs!

I'm sorry your house burned...I can't imagine going through that.

Kace

 

[Bugoutbusman]

There's at least 3 MOBILE RV/Bus mechanics down there besides the RV dealership mechanics who can do inspections after it's fixed...They come to you. With all the lakes and RV parks around there, No Problems on Bus or RV issues and they are very reasonable. One of them even fixed my old Pepsi machine since he did AC work and knew how. $20. He was there already, but that's all he charged for it.

When you're ready to fix everything when it's warmer, I highly recommend going to Colaw's in Joplin for parts if you are mechanical. They are an RV salvage yard that carries bus parts too. They also have new stuff but at deeply discounted prices. They even Pull the Parts off their units that you drive around in a golf cart, write down what you want from the number on the unit and then they load it for you. Great Place!

I'd forget getting that bus on the road right now.

Have your friend take you to get a Drivers License before the pot authentication.
Pick out a car online from one of the dealerships in the area...or in Branson since you have a friend there.
Call them, tell them which one you want. Inventory is online.
They will deliver it to your location and All Paperwork and Payment Can Be Done There. Normally two people come out to drive their other car back when there's no trade in. The finance manager or dealership owner will probably be one of the people that will come out.

I'm assuming you are paying cash from your posts so talk to the Dealership Owner or Finance Manager Only about it. They understand many people in those areas pay cash for vehicles, so it's No Big Deal and they don't ask questions about it. That's farm and cattle country... cash is readily welcomed unlike some other places.
Use your friends address and then change it when your 30day tag expires and you register it permanently if you want.

They will deliver the vehicle anywhere you want within reason...100miles if you don't want anyone coming to your bus.

Get insurance on the vehicle the day you get it. Have the insurance card sent to your phone in case you are pulled over and all mailings sent to a PO Box or to your friends place.

Tag it permanently within 30days for 2yrs.

Done.

You can be legal and on the road by Friday at the latest.

Pick an authenticator and appraiser.

Or... Since that pot is enamelware/cookware, you might call the Arabia Steamboat Museum in KC and ask for one of the Hawley family who they recommend since many of the things on that ship fall into that category. It sank in 1856. Was found, recovered by 3 families that were friends and other friends helped. They were treasure hunters. It has the largest collection of pre civil war artifacts in the world and All of the stuff was authenticated, appraised and is on display.

It's a great place to visit...if you go and If you don't find a similar pot there, very close to that location are reputable galleries with the type of access to the professional help you need to get the authentication and appraisal. You normally don't just walk in...make an appointment.

Kace

That all sounds good, thank you.
Im not gunna bother with the buses for now, or buying a car. I dont have enough cash so it would require cashing in some gold. Im not cashing in any until i get out of here and then figure out how to cash out under radar. I will have my buddy from branson west give me a ride. I spoke to relatives in germany, they said it does look like antiques in germany, but they are no experts by any means.
In my own online research it says the pots with rivited handles are older, and the color of the thin stripe around the lip can indicate region, or something like that.
American enamelware has a stamp in the center of the bottom, the very center of the bottom is intact and there is no stamp. No manufacture anywhere....unless it was way off center under the shotgun blast...which isnt likely.
Of course im still going with a antiques expert...but sitting here until that happens im just looking stuff up.

 

[MidMoTreasure]

Us lawyer folk are often the bearers of bad news, and I think I had better add a few comments about treasure troves and taxes. Unfortunately, the kettle of gold coins found by Mr. Carter is immediately subject to federal and Missouri state income taxes. That’s right, treasure, or at least it’s estimated value, is considered income. 26 CFR 1.61-14 states, in relevant part: “Treasure trove, to the extent of its value in United States currency, constitutes gross income for the taxable year in which it is reduced to undisputed possession.”

The IRS has a very broad definition of what constitutes income for tax purposes. It’s not just money we earn from our jobs or gambling winnings or the like. (Aside: How many prostitutes, loan sharks, and drug dealers actually report their income??) Remember, Al Capone was done in by tax evasion, not his other dirty deeds (not done dirt cheap, apparently).

Remember the couple who found the Saddle Ridge Horde of gold coins in the state of California? They had to pay nearly 47 percent of the estimated value of the gold coins in state and federal taxes before even selling a single coin! So, if Mr. Carter did find a kettle full of gold, his tax obligation exists regardless of whether or not he sells a single coin. His posting on another site in March of 2018 indicated he didn’t find the treasure then, but this post indicates he had discovered it by November. Therefore, he would owe taxes based on the estimated value of his treasure for tax year 2018. I would advise against “hiding it from the Feds” because the IRS is the one government agency that is somewhat efficient in what it does, and is pretty ruthless in its pursuit of unpaid taxes.

It goes without saying that talking publicly about hiding taxable income from the Feds is a bad thing. (Also, actually hiding taxable income from the Feds is a bad thing.)

Don’t shoot the messenger, even if he be a lawyer.

 

[Kace]

Us lawyer folk are often the bearers of bad news, and I think I had better add a few comments about treasure troves and taxes. Unfortunately, the kettle of gold coins found by Mr. Carter is immediately subject to federal and Missouri state income taxes. That’s right, treasure, or at least it’s estimated value, is considered income. 26 CFR 1.61-14 states, in relevant part: “Treasure trove, to the extent of its value in United States currency, constitutes gross income for the taxable year in which it is reduced to undisputed possession.”

The IRS has a very broad definition of what constitutes income for tax purposes. It’s not just money we earn from our jobs or gambling winnings or the like. (Aside: How many prostitutes, loan sharks, and drug dealers actually report their income??) Remember, Al Capone was done in by tax evasion, not his other dirty deeds (not done dirt cheap, apparently).

Remember the couple who found the Saddle Ridge Horde of gold coins in the state of California? They had to pay nearly 47 percent of the estimated value of the gold coins in state and federal taxes before even selling a single coin! So, if Mr. Carter did find a kettle full of gold, his tax obligation exists regardless of whether or not he sells a single coin. His posting on another site in March of 2018 indicated he didn’t find the treasure then, but this post indicates he had discovered it by November. Therefore, he would owe taxes based on the estimated value of his treasure for tax year 2018. I would advise against “hiding it from the Feds” because the IRS is the one government agency that is somewhat efficient in what it does, and is pretty ruthless in its pursuit of unpaid taxes.

It goes without saying that talking publicly about hiding taxable income from the Feds is a bad thing. (Also, actually hiding taxable income from the Feds is a bad thing.)

Don’t shoot the messenger, even if he be a lawyer.

Thank You for posting this and explaining it plainly as an attorney Bryan.

I do not agree with the US Treasure Trove Laws but....My thoughts are, if say for a round figure you recover a $50k treasure in coin. The tax laws being what they are and you have to pay $25kish of that in taxes, you're still $25k Ahead of where you were Before recovering it. Mentally, you have to tell yourself "I just found $25k'...Sweet!"

A great CPA and Attorney working together that's very up on the laws and the way to benefit the most legally is a must as is letting them do any talking.

Staying offline with claims of recovered treasure is a must and using the name of our leader online is a must when on sites online. Instant Flag. Also using the names of who owned and buried it brings out heirs who are entitled to a portion of it as is whatever agreement or non agreement with the landowner.

Does the Tommy Thompson deal fall under the same laws as this or is that only because of investors claims of being scammed? It's my understanding he can remain in that Ohio prison indefinitely until he reveals the location of the gold coins and is being fined 1k per day.
Is that correct?

Thanks Again,

Kace

 

[MidMoTreasure]

The Thompson case is a little different. First, his group did pay taxes and did sell a bulk of their finds. However, the alleged "missing" 500 or so coins became the subject of a federal fraud case. The Judge found that Mr. Thompson had violated a plea agreement by concealing the coins, and ordered him to disclose their whereabouts. Mr. Thompson refused, and the judge found him in contempt of court and ordered him imprisoned until he complied. Mr. Thompson has given his explanation but it apparently did not satisfy the judge. The judge has a lot of power when it comes to contempt of court.

I haven't heard about the Thompson case since last spring when it was reported that Thompson was appealing his contempt charge. It's gone quiet since, maybe I will look into this during some down time in the coming week.

For the record, I don't agree with the treasure trove law either. I don't agree that the Feds make us declare our found clad as income. Perhaps we can write off that new metal detector as a business expense?

 

[Bugoutbusman]

I just sold all the coins at face value for $1000. And ive left the other cache alone...wish i could remember where that was.

 

[Bugoutbusman]

You are right, i should pay the taxes on my $1000 income, thanks for that info. It scared me so bad i decided to do the right thing.

 

[Bugoutbusman]

Church hollow

I see the 47% tax that started the civil war is still in effect then

 

[Bugoutbusman]

Church hollow

Not sure whats up...but 2 choppers circling my area, my internet is very unstable, and all my texts are sending in double. Im guessing the feds are about to raid me...lets hope not.
I bet i got my own satalite by now

 

[Kace]

The Thompson case is a little different. First, his group did pay taxes and did sell a bulk of their finds. However, the alleged "missing" 500 or so coins became the subject of a federal fraud case. The Judge found that Mr. Thompson had violated a plea agreement by concealing the coins, and ordered him to disclose their whereabouts. Mr. Thompson refused, and the judge found him in contempt of court and ordered him imprisoned until he complied. Mr. Thompson has given his explanation but it apparently did not satisfy the judge. The judge has a lot of power when it comes to contempt of court.

I haven't heard about the Thompson case since last spring when it was reported that Thompson was appealing his contempt charge. It's gone quiet since, maybe I will look into this during some down time in the coming week.

For the record, I don't agree with the treasure trove law either. I don't agree that the Feds make us declare our found clad as income. Perhaps we can write off that new metal detector as a business expense?

Thanks for clarifying that...I'm not familiar with all of the particulars of that story from beginning to present.

I suppose we could write off the detectors and tools, gas, mileage, batteries, gps etc if we set it up as a business! lol!

That's funny you said that, I had a similar discussion with friends who's daughter races mini sprints on the small town oval dirt tracks. She just graduated from a year of cart racing.

Those little sprints have a small cc motorcycle engine and they had to set it up as a business due to the winnings she won...a lot of times the drivers are paid just for starting the race or completing one lap. Not a large amount. They are listed as the owners and they have a few small sponsors and she's listed as the driver.

Her dad said they were shocked to find out the necessity of setting something like that up as a business due to the relatively small amount of income vs cost of doing it. I don't think the engine in that car cost more than the AT Max I recently bought... of course it was bored over and hopped up from stock a bit after they bought it, but still...Get a hobby for you or your kid and gotta pay taxes! lol!

Thank You,
Kace

 

[Ol' Kentuck]

Insert winking Cass picture here....LMAO!

I reckon Mama Cass says it best.




I see "helicopters and tapped cellphones" have been added.

Hell the only thing missin now is Roving Bands Of Rich Historians Clutching Their Checkbooks and Google Spy's in dark glasses ta complete the Dejapoo.