Carpet of nails...

[darktower007]

This is assuming your running: 17khz Low frequency coil (also assumed lower freq would not do any good due to Ferrus content)
In a carpet of nails do you:
Run full tones and if so what reactivity and what silencer?

Or

Do you run disc and if so what reactivity and silencer?

Thanks!

 

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[Calabash Digger]

I'm running that pitch program I sent you in a carpet of nails.

 

[vferrari]

That^

 

[darktower007]

Yes I’ve tried it, and it’s super deep but what about looking for high conductors instead of mid conductors like relics? Does it handle trash well too?
And is it ever warranted to go to reactivity of 4 or even 5 and increase silencer if the iron is ridiculous?

 

[vferrari]

Yes I’ve tried it, and it’s super deep but what about looking for high conductors instead of mid conductors like relics? Does it handle trash well too?
And is it ever warranted to go to reactivity of 4 or even 5 and increase silencer if the iron is ridiculous?

Why do you think the pitch unmasking program is for mid-conductors only? If you want to hit deeper high conductors, then lower your frequency to 8 or 12. I would not run full tones/no disc in a nail carpet bed because the numerous ferrous targets will drag down tone and visual ID's if no discrimination is applied, yet you may still want to hear the iron. The solution is the pitch program where you can apply discrimination, hear the discriminated iron via iron volume (which you can't do if you use discrimination and full tones) and listen for the pitch tone indicating anything non-ferrous (but need to be careful you are not actually hearing iron wraparound, that is why I notch 97-99 for any pitch program using an LF frequency). As far as tweaking reactivity and silencer, that really is something you would have to trial and error tweak in the field. I think keeping reactivity 2 to 2.5 is a good choice and perhaps push it up to 3 if really thick. I would tend to stay away from using any silencer, but it could make a positive difference under these extreme conditions. HTH. Oh, and if the nails or other iron tends to be consistently deep (5 or more inches), lowering sensitivity or running at 18 khz (ideally higher if you have an HF coil) may help unmask keepers that are lying ABOVE the iron since you are limiting signal penetration to the keeper target and not allowing it to penetrate all the way to the masking iron. It is a hit or miss proposition, but just another know you can tweak in the field to see if it makes a difference.

 

[beep1971]

I'd run in a disc program. 17Khz is still a relatively high freq, and as such will give iron a stronger signal, which in turn makes it easier for the disc channel to filter it, full tones would be overcome.
Some modern galvanized coated nails are harder to disc out as the galv coating raises it higher nearer to foil, but old nails, no problem.
Set your tone break low, if your digging too much iron raise it a little. If i don't dig the odd small nail on a hunt i lower my tone break.

 

[Calabash Digger]

He might be speaking of silver coins here.. (coinshooting) imo pitch not good in modern trash and coin shooting senarios.. That doesn't mean it wont nail high conducters it just means the modern trash will give you problems.... if you are looking for coins in a park or modern yard I would go another way but for flat out relic hunting it flat out kills.... My hunting partner has dug 2 trimes in the last few weeks with the pitch program... I run reactivity at 2 95% of the time and move to 3 in super thick iron and never above that... I find reactivity of 3 helps with falsing nail heads in thick iron and I don't use the 97-99 notch for wrap around I deal with it tonally (in pitch) and I don't dig a whole lot of iron , some but not a BIG problem.

Yes I’ve tried it, and it’s super deep but what about looking for high conductors instead of mid conductors like relics? Does it handle trash well too?
And is it ever warranted to go to reactivity of 4 or even 5 and increase silencer if the iron is ridiculous?

 

[vferrari]

Good point, modern trash would be a problem in pure pitch. But if you get a repeatable pitch tone, you can often get a visual target ID to lock in if the modern trash is shallow, and you can move on based son the displayed TID. I need to do more experimentation with lower Disc settings as I just go with 6 to 10 with the unmasker (and what beep1971 is referring to when he mentions the tone break) because non-ferrous detection depth should be unaffected and it keeps the horseshoe graphic stable. Calabash, what do you gain by keeping disc right at the “edge” with a 2 or 3 setting? I am sure I am missing something and you have the finds to prove it.

 

[Calabash Digger]

I'm running a disc of 10 and have been doing well with it. I might bring it down some and see what happens.. TNSHARPSHOOTER or SQURRIEL1 says that when you bump the disc up ( I think he said above 6 or 7 I might be wrong on the number) that you start losing 3D unmasking capabilities. I have not tested that myself.... I talked to a guy who knows ALAIN and he told him he wouldn't run the deus with the disc below 8 and that got me thinking awhile back. 10 has been working well for me and Keith but I might pull it back some.

 

[vferrari]

Doh. Early onset senility. You said 2 or 3 “reactivity” and I somehow read it as “discrimination”. My bad. Glad to know you are running disc where I am (10). I think beep1971 liked to run it at 6 too and I noticed a lot of the presets have it at 6.1.

 

[Jeff H]

Been toying with Pitch also. The wrap around squeak from those square nails that infest the cellar hole rim does annoy the heck out of me. But like Calabash says, pushing Reactivity up to 3 helps the cause. I've been using Disc at 10. I suspect I could move that a few points either way and not really notice the difference. I haven't notched out the iron wrap around yet but I am tempted to Maybe I'll just lower the Pitch tone and I will find it less objectionable. Anyway, I got 20 inches of new snow yesterday and single digit temps today. It will just be air testing for me for a while I am afraid

 

[vferrari]

Jeff - What frequency are you typically running in pitch.

 

[darktower007]

The deus takes time to learn. I was pissed when I first got it thinking $1200 bucks down the drain.. but as I stuck with it I learned what bottle caps do, deep iron, and crappy signals are most often junk. I’ve gotten better at digging better targets.

This machine is so customizable ( your yet it doesn’t take a Quantum Physics degree to understand it like a V3i....Endless settings)


I’m a coin hunter as I hunt parks and such a lot, but on cleaner sites I do use pitch.

I still wish (like the equinox I have read) no matter what frequency you choose the VDI read out doesn’t change. I don’t like ID norm so I run it off.

Rambling post over lol [emoji13]

 

[Calabash Digger]

I do notice in the thickest it will do that a lot with that reactivity of 2 but 3 seems to fix it for me with the HF 9 coil. I really like the 28 kh......in iron!

Been toying with Pitch also. The wrap around squeak from those square nails that infest the cellar hole rim does annoy the heck out of me. But like Calabash says, pushing Reactivity up to 3 helps the cause. I've been using Disc at 10. I suspect I could move that a few points either way and not really notice the difference. I haven't notched out the iron wrap around yet but I am tempted to Maybe I'll just lower the Pitch tone and I will find it less objectionable. Anyway, I got 20 inches of new snow yesterday and single digit temps today. It will just be air testing for me for a while I am afraid

 

[Tedyoh]

This is assuming your running: 17khz Low frequency coil (also assumed lower freq would not do any good due to Ferrus content)
In a carpet of nails do you:
Run full tones and if so what reactivity and what silencer?

Or

Do you run disc and if so what reactivity and silencer?

Thanks!

If I HAD to run 18khz in a carpet of nails with the LF coil I'd run Gary's Sifter Program....ive also run R4 and R5....you just have to listen for that real real real short blip of a high tone.

 

[Jeff H]

Jeff - What frequency are you typically running in pitch.

V, I should have noted I am still using the LF coils. So either 18 or 12 kHz.

 

[vferrari]

V, I should have noted I am still using the LF coils. So either 18 or 12 kHz.

I would try upping reactivity as Calabash and Darktower mentioned before notching wraparound (and in that case I would ONLY use notch at 12 khz (unless you are using ID Norm in which case I would not notch at all) because at 18 khz or 12 khz with ID Norm you might miss some legit high conductors by notching high) and/or also lowering sensitivity as Ted mentioned a la the sifter. I would be interested in what Tedyoh has to say about this, but I am not a fan of running sifter outright in these conditions because Gary recommends full tones and 0-1 disc and I fear that leaves you susceptible to iron down averaging which is why disc (10) + pitch is recommended for unmasking.

 

[Tedyoh]

I would try upping reactivity as Calabash and Darktower mentioned before notching wraparound (and in that case I would ONLY use notch at 12 khz (unless you are using ID Norm in which case I would not notch at all) because at 18 khz or 12 khz with ID Norm you might miss some legit high conductors by notching high) and/or also lowering sensitivity as Ted mentioned a la the sifter. I would be interested in what Tedyoh has to say about this, but I am not a fan of running sifter outright in these conditions because Gary recommends full tones and 0-1 disc and I fear that leaves you susceptible to iron down averaging which is why disc (10) + pitch is recommended for unmasking.

Well I was just kinda of the top of my head responding to the OP's question, on using the LF coil and 18 khZ, read into it too much i suppose, like if no other options (frequency) were possible, and assumed we were talking about an old home site of foundation....

Before I had the HF coil, Gary's Sifter program was the last program I'd use at a site before I felt I "got most of the targets" - I hunt for relics, at no to very low modern trash sites, so for me that means I will dig anything that comes in, sounds better than iron - give me a clean signal reading at 25 and I'm digging, knowing it's probably a shard of brass or tin, I don't care, so the high conductors getting drug down by iron theory I never really think about as I just about "dig it all". To me the low TX and low sensitivity settings work great together to help unmask in super heavy iron (nail beds) by not overloading the coil and machine with all that rusty ferrous the coil is seeing. I tried CD's pitch program with the LF coil and didn't find anything I missed.

Enter the HF coil - the last chance I had to detect was the week after thanksgiving before deer season in PA for a few hours - went to one of my favorite old relic home sites armed with the HF coil, CD's Pitch Program in the backpack and the rifle slung over my shoulder, (this dual outdoor adventure worked out better than I though, detected from 1pm to 3pm then deer hunted 'till dark) only went over a small 50' x 50' area, some keepers were 2 shallow fatty indians, few suspender clips, fork and spoon parts, a deep sleigh bell and a very cool old lever lock, oldest lock I've found (I knew this was big iron) - plus I was battling high dead weeds so I can't wait 'till spring...it's about an acre site, looking at it as virgin again due to CD's Pitch Program and the HF coil

CD's Pitch Program along with the HF coil is finding stuff I missed with the LF coil - CD's pitch program is now my last program I will be using for that "I got about all of the targets at this site" feeling.....I too may lower the disc. down to 5 or so though.

 

[vferrari]

I presume you were running "CD' s Pitch Program" at 28 khz vs. 14 khz and that made the difference since it was doing nothing for you with the LF coil. You never mentioned frequency.

 

[Tedyoh]

I presume you were running "CD' s Pitch Program" at 28 khz vs. 14 khz and that made the difference since it was doing nothing for you with the LF coil. You never mentioned frequency.

Yes.....i started in 28 when I first received the coil in all my programs....for the very reason you mentioned above....im still kinda wondering why they even put in 14 with the HF coils