Bavaria Germany found this ancient Roman Catholic piece?

[sarasotadigger84]

Hello all it's been a while since I posted. But I was out visiting my wife's family in Bavaria over the weekend and using my Ace 400 stumbled upon this beautiful piece. Cant seem to quite figure out what it is. Does seem religious with Latin inscription I believe. I have contacted a few professionals but have not heard back yet. Thanks guys.

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

How to Research for Treasure Hunting and Metal Detecting From Lead Generation to Vetting - Grab it through Amazon!

[keossvin]

Looks like an late medieval seal matrix

 

[sarasotadigger84]

Okay that sounds interesting.

 

[sarasotadigger84]

Looks like an late medieval seal matrix

Yes it sure does. And some belong in.museums, I see they are quite valuable as well.

 

[Blak bart]

Incredible piece...wow. congrats !!

 

[sarasotadigger84]

Thank you very much.

 

[keossvin]

Yes it sure does. And some belong in.museums, I see they are quite valuable as well.

i suggest you make an report to your local archeologist because it is required by law.

U don’t think they wil take it to the museum, those matrix’s are somewhat common. Almost every high ranking catholic person had one.

 

[Noah_D]

Vesica seal matrix imo, I know I'm a bit late to the party but here's a little tidbit:
"In the Middle Ages it became customary for the seals of women and of ecclesiastics to be given a vesica (pointed oval) shape. The central emblem was often a standing figure of the owner, or (in the case of ecclesiastical seals) of a saint. Medieval townspeople used a wide variety of different emblems but some had seals that included an image relating to their work.[15]" -The Wikipedia page cited a book but I don't have access to it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vesica_piscis
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seal_(emblem)#Seal_design

 

[sarasotadigger84]

Okay very interesting. I have reached out to a few people and waiting to hear back.

 

[sarasotadigger84]

Thank you very much for the information. That's just a great find for me. I am happy

 

[Red-Coat]

Terrific find and I will be interested to hear what the experts have to say.

The part that I am able to read appears to say: S ALBERTI… with a distinct space between the S and the A but the spacing thereafter is somewhat uncertain, as is the continuation of the letters… which look like PPT

Note that the E is in mediaeval gothic style, somewhat like this:



I wonder if this might relate to Saint Albert the Great (Albert Magnus/Albert of Cologne), the prominent German Catholic Dominican Friar and Bishop of the 13th Century. Although he wasn’t formally canonised by the Catholic Church until 1931, he was certainly regarded with saintlihood by his followers long before that, and particularly after he was beatified in 1622. The Catholic Church now distinguishes him as one of the 36 Doctors of the Church

 

[sarasotadigger84]

Terrific find and I will be interested to hear what the experts have to say.

The part that I am able to read appears to say: S ALBERTI… with a distinct space between the S and the A but the spacing thereafter is somewhat uncertain, as is the continuation of the letters… which look like PPT

Note that the E is in mediaeval gothic style, somewhat like this:

View attachment 1836759

I wonder if this might relate to Saint Albert the Great (Albert Magnus/Albert of Cologne), the prominent German Catholic Dominican Friar and Bishop of the 13th Century. Although he wasn’t formally canonised by the Catholic Church until 1931, he was certainly regarded with saintlihood by his followers long before that, and particularly after he was beatified in 1622. The Catholic Church now distinguishes him as one of the 36 Doctors of the Church

Wow that would be insane. I am waiting to hear back. This quite interesting. I am happy you were able to come up with very interesting research. Thank you kindly.

 

[sarasotadigger84]

Wow that would be insane. I am waiting to hear back. This quite interesting. I am happy you were able to come up with very interesting research. Thank you kindly.

I emailed these guys, I have found 2 on this page that are or seem similar.

001. spitzovale Siegel und/oder Kirchen-Siegel (15 Siegel) | Petschaften-Archiv

 

[A2coins]

Amazing find I hope you can keep it I would not be happy if they kept it LOL keep us posted what a cool find.....

 

[sarasotadigger84]

Amazing find I hope you can keep it I would not be happy if they kept it LOL keep us posted what a cool find.....

A2 I sure will update as soon as I know some things. It was found on private property and it wasnt associated to any horde or more than 1 item in the hole so I am thinking I am safe.

 

[ArfieBoy]

Great find! Good luck with I.D.!

 

[Retired Sarge]

Following this, awesome find.........

 

[sarasotadigger84]

Found these in the same yard.

Great find! Good luck with I.D.![/QUOT


These were also found in the yard.

 

[Red-Coat]

Good luck with an ID. The actual pictorial part of the design may not help since you will likely find generic similarities. I think it will be the inscription that gives you the best pointer and maybe even then not a date. I'm having great difficulty reading the other part. My reading, starting from the last letter of a word at the broken edge would be:

? (possibly a D)
+
E (I’m pretty sure)
? (possibly a C)
? (possibly an O)
? (possibly a C)
+
? (possibly a G)
? (possibly an A)
? (probably an R)
Z (probably)
Z (probably)
E (I’m sure)
N (I’m sure)
+

The double letter I’ve assigned as two Zs are ‘backwards’ (allowing for the fact that a seal has backwards letters anyway) but I can’t see them as anything else. They’re very angular and quite unlike the very obviously rounded S on the other part of the legend. I mentioned ‘blundered’ legends on another post, so I think the Z letters are probably blundered.

Note also that apart from the archaic font and uncertainly about spacing, there are two additional problems in reading. One is archaic spellings. The other is that words are commonly abbreviated, requiring you to mentally fill in the dropped letters. For example Nürnberg (Nuremberg for English speakers) often appears as NORNB on old tokens and jetons.

If the middle word is GARZZEN, then it might be intended for Garssen in the Lower Saxony part of Germany, but a that's a long way from Bavaria.

 

[sarasotadigger84]

Very interesting observations. I hope that I will be able to have it verified by a expert very soon in the next days. I will keep you posted.