ball projectile (update) 16th Century battle near my house

[Discrimination Dave]

I have pretty much confirmed that this is an old musket ball.
I did some research and found that muskets arrived in japan in 1543 via a Dutch shipwreck.
By 1560 they had been replicated and were in use all over Japan.
One of the three dudes credited with unifying feudal japan towards the end of a really long civil war(late 16th Century), Oda Nobunaga was famous for his musket tactics. He used three rows of foot soldiers for his muskets, the forward row firing only and the rear two reloading only. He won a decisive battle that way. Turns out he (Oda Nobunaga) destroyed a castle at Mount Shigi in 1578 and it is only 1.92 miles from my house (measured on Google Earth)
I also read that the size of musket balls were from 13mm to 20 mm. Mine is 14mm - 15mm.
So I am hyped and have a little treasure I think.
I am going to climb that mountain and hunt the castle ruins when it warms up a little.
Thanks for looking.
dave

 

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[birdman]

Nice history lession.Good find.

 

[JP]

cool find

looking forward to your future posts

thanks for sharing the history.

 

[goldnow]

I found an earlier version of the arquebus, called a handgonne or hand cannon, from circa 1380, and though never delved into this history before, was fascinated with what I found out. I also found some musket balls that fit nearby. I've been looking for another ever since and dig every large iron signal in hopes.

Great find,... now go and find the gun barrel.

 

[Deepdiger60]

That,s fascinating how 1 musket ball can tell all that history Great find Good luck up on the Mountain .

 

[Discrimination Dave]

I found an earlier version of the arquebus, called a handgonne or hand cannon, from circa 1380, and though never delved into this history before, was fascinated with what I found out. I also found some musket balls that fit nearby. I've been looking for another ever since and dig every large iron signal in hopes.

Great find,... now go and find the gun barrel.

Where are you GoldNow? I know you aren't in the States if you found a arequebus from 1380!
I checked your profile but didnt see a map or any info.
d.

 

[goldnow]

I found an earlier version of the arquebus, called a handgonne or hand cannon, from circa 1380, and though never delved into this history before, was fascinated with what I found out. I also found some musket balls that fit nearby. I've been looking for another ever since and dig every large iron signal in hopes.

Great find,... now go and find the gun barrel.

Where are you GoldNow? I know you aren't in the States if you found a arequebus from 1380!
I checked your profile but didnt see a map or any info.
d.

I'm in Italy. I'm American, my wife is Italian.. Here is the link to the post with my handgonne find.
The handgonne is a few decades before the Arquebus. The main differences being the introduction of a flash-pan for the gunpowder and the serpentine attached for lighting the gunpowder..The handgonne/hand cannon is the first and most primitive hand gun.. They did make large cannons first and slowly brought the dimensions down to hand size.

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,272589.msg1941263.html#msg1941263

 

[seger98]

good detective work, nice find.

 

[BuckleBoy]

That single musket ball is a more interesting and rich find than a single ball from the American Civil War. Great history, and some Beautiful firearms on Wikipedia.

Cheers,


Buckleboy

 

[DCMatt]

Wow! Very cool!

Do you know the name of the castle? I tried a little research on Nobunaga but it is very confusing.

I look forward to your future postings.

Good luck.

DCMatt

 

[ivan salis]

ah davy I see you took our chat to heart , and studied up a bit your local japanese history * -- guns always were and still are very highly controlled in japan * because once guns came on the scene --the highly skilled master warrior class "samurai" could easily be killed by a lowly basically unskillled musket man, this caused a major shift in battle tactics and shook up the old "status quo" quite a bit . -- the warlords that embraced this new weapon and the right tactics for its effective use had a huge advantage over those that did not .

 

[Discrimination Dave]

Wow! Very cool!

Do you know the name of the castle? I tried a little research on Nobunaga but it is very confusing.

I look forward to your future postings.

Good luck.

DCMatt

Hey DCMatt,
It is confusing trying to research this Oda Nobunaga stuff, especially and specifically the battle actions in my neighborhood.
I have only one decent history book and it doesn't even mention the siege at Shigisan (Mount Shigi). Also, the culture here is preoccupied with Temples and Shrines when it comes to history. They (for obvious reasons) dont seek out military history.
I have only found limited accounts of the battle at Shigisan, but enough to know that it did happen and actually was 1577 (not 1578 as I originally posted).
I guess Nobunaga had a little help from this dude: Tsutsui Junkei, as the link below briefly mentions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsutsui_Junkei

Here is another link:
Scroll down to 1577 then the date September 28.
http://din-timelines.com/1570-1579_timeline.shtml


What makes it more confusing is that Nobunaga's brothers and sons had names very similar to himself. Remember "Oda" is the family name and "Nobunaga" is his given name.
His brothers and sons: Oda Nobuyuki, Oda Nobumasu, Oda Nobuharu, Oda Nobutada, Oda Nobutaka and Oda Nobuo.
see link of all Oda Generals: http://www.samurai-archives.com/odaret.html

If you want an interesting read on the IMPORTANT crap concerning the 16th century unification of japan, (and true origin of Speed Racer and the Toyota Lexis) these are the three names you need to know:
Oda Nobunaga, Toyotomi Hideyoshi and Tokugawa Ieyasu.

I dont know how to upload a link from google earth, but I will upload a couple of pics of the exact location of the battle and castle ruins.
dave.




Thank you for the interest!
dave

 

[Discrimination Dave]

ah davy I see you took our chat to heart , and studied up a bit your local japanese history * -- guns always were and still are very highly controlled in japan * because once guns came on the scene --the highly skilled master warrior class "samurai" could easily be killed by a lowly basically unskillled musket man, this caused a major shift in battle tactics and shook up the old "status quo" quite a bit . -- the warlords that embraced this new weapon and the right tactics for its effective use had a huge advantage over those that did not .

I heard you well Ivy-baby.
Have gun will change history as you like to say.

 

[Dave N Japan]

I like that a.....lot" Wish I could find something like that on okinawa

 

[Rivers rat]

Segoi!!!!!!


RR