Bad Electolysis....Bad.....

[Blind.In.Texas]

.

 

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[Gypsy Heart]

Good Grief!

 

[viper771]

Yikes! For small stuff I put together a machine using one of those big 6V(The large rectangle ones used in big flashlights) for the power source..

But for big stuff I use a car battery charger. I don't think i have ever dissolved anything before.. except for some of the clip on the stainless steel. it fell into the tank and started to eat it away..

 

[jeff of pa]

LOL

Been there, Done that

best process for coppers I found was

"Dip & Brush"

Usually 15 to 30 second Dips
then use a tooth brush, then Dip again.

How long each dip depends on how much Reaction I get
from the Dipping. IF the item is immediatly surrounded by Bubbles
less then if I need to hold it in for awhile before seeing
a reaction.

I never do it to a coin that has no Crust.
or is Green.

 

[CoinSniper]

I think when I used to use electrolysis, I used one of those Estes hobby model rocket launcher controls... you can probably buy one separately at Wal-Mart for fairly cheap... it has 2 clips you fasten onto the object and you tape the launch button down while operating. I believe the voltage was only 9V or so... may have used a few AAA batteries instead.

 

[Hill City Rebel]

Maybe one of you fellows can explain an experience I'm having with cleaning a dime with electrolysis. I'm using a small 3.7 volt AC/DC transformer that was a power supply for some electrical gadget I once had. The bath is a cup of water with a teaspoon of bleach added for the electrolyte, and the anode is a stainless steel spoon. The problem is this: The dime won't come clean! It's very heavily encrusted, though I can see the date - 1873 - and the stream of bubbles coming from it indicates the reaction is taking place, but... it won't clean up! It's been going for 3 days now, with hardly a change in appearance. Meanwhile, the spoon has become a hopeless glob of corrosion. Any ideas?

 

[teverly]

The bleach is eating the spoon...and basically as the water heats up you are just boiling the bleach off.
Try using plain old table salt..thats what i use..
Also make sure the posts are hooked to the correct things....since i have crs and it has been a while i cant remember which to hook to the coin and which one goes on the spoon...
maybe someone else can help us out with that..

 

[stoney56]

Try looking at this thread.

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,10898.0.html

 

[Timberwolf]

DC current flows negative to positive... so connect the negative wire to the object you want cleaned and the positive wire to a piece of stainless steel.

Tom

 

[Hill City Rebel]

The bleach is eating the spoon...and basically as the water heats up you are just boiling the bleach off.
Try using plain old table salt..thats what i use..
Also make sure the posts are hooked to the correct things....since i have crs and it has been a while i cant remember which to hook to the coin and which one goes on the spoon...
maybe someone else can help us out with that..

Sorry, but bleach won't eat steel, whatever the temperature (think of your steel clothes washer and the steel piping associated with it), whereas salt will. I therefore prefer bleach to salt because it's not nearly as corrosive to the metals. Thanks for the input, though.

 

[timbuckII]

Sorry, but bleach won't eat steel, whatever the temperature (think of your steel clothes washer and the steel piping associated with it), whereas salt will. I therefore prefer bleach to salt because it's not nearly as corrosive to the metals. Thanks for the input, though.
[/quote]

Oh yes it will, try putting a nail in a cup of bleach and see how long it lasts. Stainless may take a little linger but it to will pit and start to disappear. If you do use bleach DO NOT get it to hot or breath it. It also has to be neutralized.

TC

 

[cosmic]

Not the bleach, but the composition of the bleach that eats the metal.. Have you seen bleach packaged in metal containers? Plastic and way back when, (Guess I'm old!) glass.. Bleach is chlorine gas water and caustic soda (sodium hydroxide).. It uses oxygenation to whiten clothes.. Same way rust is formed on metal.. To much current or corossive in solution is the problem..Just some info..( I was a chemical operator in a bleach plant for 15 years.)

 

[Hill City Rebel]

Sorry, but bleach won't eat steel, whatever the temperature (think of your steel clothes washer and the steel piping associated with it), whereas salt will. I therefore prefer bleach to salt because it's not nearly as corrosive to the metals. Thanks for the input, though.

Oh yes it will, try putting a nail in a cup of bleach and see how long it lasts. Stainless may take a little linger but it to will pit and start to disappear. If you do use bleach DO NOT get it to hot or breath it. It also has to be neutralized.

TC
[/quote]

I have taken the challenge - I've placed several nails in a container with bleach and watched the reaction for several days. I stand corrected - bleach will eat metal. A little investigation reveals that common bleach is a solution of sodium hypochlorite (NaOCl) prepared by absorbing chlorine gas (Cl2) in a solution of sodium hydroxide (NaOH). Quote from Answers.com:

"Like all hypochlorites, sodium hypochlorite is a salt of hypochlorous acid, HClO. Sodium hypochlorite solution is a light yellow green transparent liquid. In water, it partially splits into the sodium cation Na+ and the hypochlorite anion ClO−, while a substantial portion hydrolyses into sodium hydroxide and hypochlorous acid. The oxidizing power of the latter and of the hypochlorite anion cause the bleaching effect."

A byproduct of the "bleaching" process is sodium chloride (NaCl) - common table salt. I suppose that and the hypochlorous acid is what's eating the nails. And all this time I thought I was avoiding the corrosive effects of salt. Oh, well, life is complex, and salt is salt. Guess I'll renew the search for the perfect ionizing bath - perhaps the "oxygen bleach" that's advertised as an alternative to sodium hypochlorite, or some other non-salt material. Thanks for the discussion.

 

[cosmic]

I might be mistaken, but I believe we are trying to make a electrolytic solution to help the current pass through the water...
Ray

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

DC current flows negative to positive... so connect the negative wire to the object you want cleaned and the positive wire to a piece of stainless steel.

Tom

Correct. A stainless steel bolt will work fine. Stainless steel clips also preferred. I use baking soda for the electrolyte. About one cup per 5-8 gallons of water. Do not use indoors and keep watching it at least in the beginning to make sure it is not cleaning too fast.


I dont believe I have ever heard of anyone using bleach for electrolysis.

 

[Hill City Rebel]

I might be mistaken, but I believe we are trying to make a electrolytic solution to help the current pass through the water...
Ray

What we sometimes forget is that we're using is an electroplating process to remove material from our cathode. In an electroplating process, the electrolyte is usually chosen for its content of metals that will be transferred to the surface of the cathode - e.g., use a silver compound (e.g., silver nitrate that ionizes readily) along with a silver anode when silverplating an object. The implication is that any metal ions in our electrolytic cleaning solution can be plated onto the object we're cleaning, thus they're to be avoided. The electrolytes many people use for cleaning contain combinations of sodium and chlorine, neither of which will be plated on our target. As far as why the crud is removed from our target with this process... well, I haven't figured that one out yet.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I might be mistaken, but I believe we are trying to make a electrolytic solution to help the current pass through the water...
Ray

What we sometimes forget is that we're using is an electroplating process to remove material from our cathode. In an electroplating process, the electrolyte is usually chosen for its content of metals that will be transferred to the surface of the cathode - e.g., use a silver compound (e.g., silver nitrate that ionizes readily) along with a silver anode when silverplating an object. The implication is that any metal ions in our electrolytic cleaning solution can be plated onto the object we're cleaning, thus they're to be avoided. The electrolytes many people use for cleaning contain combinations of sodium and chlorine, neither of which will be plated on our target. As far as why the crud is removed from our target with this process... well, I haven't figured that one out yet.

I have heard it described as the reverse of electroplating.

 

[cosmic]

Yes it is .. But differ in that the plating metal is in solution ...

 

[ivan salis]

" think of it as reverse" plating ---plating attracts and locks on stuff to the "metal" object by drawing it to it and chemically & electricailly binding it to it.--- rusting is a very,very slow form plating changes metal to rust-----(saltwater in the ocean --oxidition forms current)-------what we do is "electrically kick off " the rust coating and draw it to another "item" the spoon----you can make the "transfer" solution too strong easily and it will eat up thing badly---remember sodium is salt** ---bleach is ---soduim hydroxide----any oxide is a metal eater (rusting is oxidation) ---so bleach is * sodium hydroxide* or salt water-metal eater in simple plain terms---that why its in a plastic bottle or in the old days brown amber glass bottle (a Clorox 1/2 gallon one of which I have from the 50's) the clor come from chorine gas used to make it deadly stuff that gas.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Why use chlorine at all? Why not just use a safer baking soda solution?