✅ SOLVED Artillery shell (WWI gas shell?) help

[Shady Digger]

So a friend of mine recently asked for my help in IDing this artillery shell he has. It was given to him some years back by a coworker who dug the shell up while working on a job site in the DC area. He assumed it was a type of Parrott shell. Although it is really similar in size to Parrott shells, I really don't believe it is. Based on the completely flat base, the copper(?) band toward base (like it was designed to be fired from a modern metal casing) and the fixed hexagon fuse cap (I'm guessing) at the tip, I think it's 20th century. I found an image online of a WWI gas shell that looks really similar. Can anyone help me confirm that it is a gas shell and help me find more info about it and the gun(s) that it was designed for?

3.5in diameter
11.687 length

 

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[Tnmountains]

Thanks Shady Digger. It does look similar to a Parrot shell. I am looking at War World 1 Gas shells now. Seems we did a lot of experimenting up until around 1942 according to the Military Law Books on line in pdfs. Not seeing your shell though and thanks for checking in.

 

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[NOLA_Ken]

Hey guys, sorry for the delay. I've been pretty busy the past several days and haven't really had much free time to get on here. I've read all the replies and I greatly appreciate the input. But I feel like I should provide more input to maybe clear things up a bit. The shell does indeed belong to a friend of mine, and he has had it for many years sitting in his house as a sort of display piece, part of his collection. He had always assumed it was a Parrott rifle shell, but when we recently toured the grounds of the Manassass battlefield and got to see some relic Parrott shells up close, he noticed his shell was different. So I offered to take the pics and do some research. The photo of the painted shell did come from the internet, and I included it to support my theory of his shell being a WWI gas shell. The fuse is long gone, I'm not even sure it was dug up with a fuse in it. I assume the giant hole that runs almost the full length of the interior of the shell is where the agent would have been placed. Seeing that it's been empty and 'unfused' the entire time its been in his possession, I would think its harmless. But I'm absolutely no expert, and I'm aware that many people on here are pretty knowledgeable with old artillery pieces so I posted here to get a confirmation of its identity and maybe more information surrounding the piece and the gun that fired it.

Thanks for the feedback, and I apologize for the confusion.

Ok, just for clarity, the way these worked is the shell was filled with the chemical agent and then the bursting charge was put in, the large hex nut shaped piece should have a tube that runs into the shell that was filled with an explosive. No fuse on the front doesn't necessarily mean no filler in the rest of the shell. My cause for concern is that it was found in the DC area, and it's known that chemical weapons and materials were buried there in what is now a residential area. If it was found in that area I would have to worry that it could in fact be filled with an agent.

 

[EOD Operator]

To whomever said that our artillery shells and cannonballs are no good after all this time, that is entirely untrue.

I have had a civil war cannonball that had been submerged in the Atlantic ocean off the coast of Rehoboth Beach, DE for 140 years detonate after it dried out. Thankfully we stayed remote in our procedures and no one was hurt.

The burster tube inside chem rounds does not go bad. Explosives in general do not go bad. To elude otherwise is dangerous.

One thing people here are not mentioning is the old Army disposal technique of burying chem, and everything else for that matter. Yes, remediations are done on those lands but you have to remember that items are missed. Nothing is 100%.

Age is never an indicator of safe as they are built to be stored. And like all things, Ordnance gets grumpier as it gets older.

But don't take my word for it. I was only Explosive Ordnance Disposal for 20+ years. 😃

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[EOD Operator]

Hey guys, sorry for the delay. I've been pretty busy the past several days and haven't really had much free time to get on here. I've read all the replies and I greatly appreciate the input. But I feel like I should provide more input to maybe clear things up a bit. The shell does indeed belong to a friend of mine, and he has had it for many years sitting in his house as a sort of display piece, part of his collection. He had always assumed it was a Parrott rifle shell, but when we recently toured the grounds of the Manassass battlefield and got to see some relic Parrott shells up close, he noticed his shell was different. So I offered to take the pics and do some research. The photo of the painted shell did come from the internet, and I included it to support my theory of his shell being a WWI gas shell. The fuse is long gone, I'm not even sure it was dug up with a fuse in it. I assume the giant hole that runs almost the full length of the interior of the shell is where the agent would have been placed. Seeing that it's been empty and 'unfused' the entire time its been in his possession, I would think its harmless. But I'm absolutely no expert, and I'm aware that many people on here are pretty knowledgeable with old artillery pieces so I posted here to get a confirmation of its identity and maybe more information surrounding the piece and the gun that fired it.

Thanks for the feedback, and I apologize for the confusion.

Shady Digger,

The "hole that runs the length" of the round is for the burster tube to be inserted. The burster tube bot being present is not a good indicator that the round is inert as the agent containing section of the rounds were filled and sealed by welding them shut usually. The lack of a fuze (yes, that's spelled correctly 😃) also does not indicate that it's safe. At this point the only way to determine that would be to x-ray it. Even then, if they overfilled the round during the manufacturing process, it might be hard to tell if it's empty or not.

Hope all of this helps. Stay safe and please pass my advice, as well as the others, on to your friend. He needs to contact Tech Escort. Best way to do that would contact your nearest military EOD unit. If you need help doing so, let me know and I'll put you in touch with the right people.

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[BARKER]

Hi Shadydigger; A bit of clarity here ok. First is that I would NEVER call the Police or anyone else for no reason at all. I would NEED a reason. BUUUUTTT If it meant the difference in stopping a Crime or a Disaster or for ANYONE'S Safety you can bet I would in 1.2 flat ok. In this case I'm glad that it has remained Inert for your friend all this time. I agree that these shells are cool to look at. What has Us going here is that it "IS" a "CHEMICAL" Weapon. Gunsil is 100% wrong in saying that the old shells are completely safe. We find them here all the time. Every time they are Destroyed. Also Our Police are not slack off idiots either. Boston has 5 Forts in the Harbor from the Rev War.
Please do NOT take our warnings lightly. Contact your friend ASAP and tell him of our warnings.The catch word in this case is "CHEMICAL" Weapon.
He may have just been lucky to have kept it in the right Environmental Conditions for it not to go off or leak but that does NOT mean it is safe ok. What would happen if it gets placed in the wrong Environment ?? I'm sure you will do the Right thing in this case. I am definitely glad you responded. We were truly scared here for all involved. PLease let us know the outcome of this situation ok.
May God Bless You & Yours. PEACE:RONB

 

[NOLA_Ken]

Shady Digger,

The "hole that runs the length" of the round is for the burster tube to be inserted. The burster tube bot being present is not a good indicator that the round is inert as the agent containing section of the rounds were filled and sealed by welding them shut usually. The lack of a fuze (yes, that's spelled correctly 😃) also does not indicate that it's safe. At this point the only way to determine that would be to x-ray it. Even then, if they overfilled the round during the manufacturing process, it might be hard to tell if it's empty or not.

Hope all of this helps. Stay safe and please pass my advice, as well as the others, on to your friend. He needs to contact Tech Escort. Best way to do that would contact your nearest military EOD unit. If you need help doing so, let me know and I'll put you in touch with the right people.

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All I will add to this is that the tube on these wasn't welded, at least not this particular type, they had a lead washer that sealed them. How exactly that worked I don't know.

 

[EOD Operator]

All I will add to this is that the tube on these wasn't welded, at least not this particular type, they had a lead washer that sealed them. How exactly that worked I don't know.

True. The tube is not welded. The rest of the round is. Where the product is contained.

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[BARKER]

Hi; EOD; Does that mean that the Chemicals inside were held in place by a lead ring ?? If so then the likelihood that the lead ring rotted away a long time ago is high thus allowing the Chemicals to be ale to come into direct contact with the Shell Lining and / or body. If so then that means that the likelihood that that shell IS still contaminated thus those Chemicals can become ACTIVE. That is truly scary. I hope Shadydigger sees this ASAP. That thing is still ticking.!!!! If so then the DANGER still exists. I pray SD does the Right thing and tell his friend NOW. I await. PECE:RONB

 

[EOD Operator]

No. That ring is to hold the burster tube in place as well as align the fuze with it. It has nothing to do with the payload.

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