✅ SOLVED Another Gun ID Needed

[Bigcypresshunter]

I have what looks like an authentic antique 12 gauge muzzleloading shotgun with a heavy duty sidelock and musket cap nipple. It says 1850 OBERNDORF on the barrel and something else on the sidelock. This shotgun is heavy duty and would hold up well if abused. It has a short smoothbore barrel and a horse ring attachment. This gun looks as if it did its killing at short range.

It may be a Mauser but I cant find it in search and I cant read the sidelock. Looks like 3 words. The second word starts with a W. The third word looks like RABBIT but first letter looks more like an F like maybe FABRIK??



Added: It may be Confederate Cavalry Carbine!

 

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[Reanm8er]

Greetings Bch! I really like the pristine look of the breech plug/barrel fit. I don't do black powder anymore but if I did
I would have no reservations about shooting this one. Best wishes!

 

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[Bigcypresshunter]

Im hesitant to use a chemical now after my nipple turned black with ACV. Are yall sure Evaporust will work?

 

[Retired Sarge]

Im hesitant to use a chemical now after my nipple turned black with ACV. Are yall sure Evaporust will work?

Take a wire brush and see if you can clean the black off the nipple. Normally this is caused by leaving it in a solution too long. After you get the black off, it would have a dull gray appearance, sort of like lead or pewter.

Evaporust or a good quality oil with 4 ought steel wool will clean the scaling/rust off without disturbing the patina. As long as you clean gently.

 

[releventchair]

Im hesitant to use a chemical now after my nipple turned black with ACV. Are yall sure Evaporust will work?

I've never used evaporust.

Not sure your goal for this piece. If to never sell then there are options to "clean" it up I still don't want to mention , lest purists and certain arms collectors storm my shack bearing torches and pitchforks.

You're at a point where either painstaking/patient work to retain a patina is involved , or going back to an all white condition.
Then you still have to deal with pitting....

All barrels need a seal from moisture and air. We see the results of not having such.

One kit I built was in the white and I don't recall browning it. No I didn't blue it either. Both simply forms of controlled rust.

It eventually browned with varies splotches ,fingerprints ,powder and sweat residue.
If bad spots were found after an extended shoot of days a light buff with oiled fine steel wool knocked off the worst ,and a coat of oil blended all. Well , mostly blended.

On your piece I'd just knock the worst of the rust off with oiled fine steel wool and keep it oiled repeatedly till the rust gobs left were saturated and pores of worst areas sealed. Letting it rest while rust wetted should allow repeating the assault on worst areas after a short week or so. More patience with the patient...
. (Again ,avoid oil soaking any wood.)
The more you "clean" the more pitting will show. Bright metal showing on smooth areas with dark pits elsewhere if the metal is too clean/patina stripped.
Your choice , I'd rather have a shades of brown , oiled even layer of rust with dark specks in it , than shiny smooth areas with black hole looking craters scattered throughout..

After our slap fight and wrestling over what to do if I was there , putting it back in the shed might be an option.

 

[namxat]

Hi,

I do not know if that helps, yet the sideplate locks very similar to this gun, manufactured a mere 100 km away:

https://www.gunsinternational.com/g...-blasien-infantry-musket.cfm?gun_id=101183291

In a nutshell, it was flintlock smoothbore, fashioned after the French Charleville system (18th century, carried in the Napoleonic wars) and was later converted to percussion. From another source I know that this factory also made short cavalry carbines. So i reckon, the run of the mill was was 100 km away not so much different.

To answer the question about 1866 weapons:

I did some Research: Standard infantry guns of the large Austrian/Southern German forces were already rifled muskets with Minnie or similar bullets but muzzleloading. Prussia had an early breechloader (the famed Dreyse needle gun).

If your gun has seen action I cannot answer. In times of war often the old stuff comes out of the arsenal due to pure need. Also its carbine and therefore not a standard gun. So I would say at least possible. A modified Zündnadelgewehr for metallic cartridges was carried by some rear echelon troops in the first world war.


Greets

Namxat

I would love to see this identfied, restored and shooting!

 

[A2coins]

Great IDS awesome Calvery gun

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Im gonna mark this as SOLVED. Its an authentic 1830's era .69 caliber smoothbore flintlock made in Wurttemberg Germany, that has been professionally converted to percussion cap. We found one other example but they don't know what it is either. They thought it was Prussian, which it is not. I don't know if it is one of the many muskets sold to the Confederates and later purchased by Bannerman, like many other outdated muskets from Germany, but its certainly possible. I wish there was a list of serial numbers or the markings stamped under the barrel. I dont know if it was converted to a Cavalry Carbine in Germany or in the states during the Civil War. Hopefully someone will Google this in the future and add something to prove or disprove this theory.

 

[Retired Sarge]

Safety Warning

Bigcypresshunter and Huston recently posted rifle ID posts. Just a warning to everyone out there wanting to shoot these Ole Gals.

Today I was doing my second post Hurricsne Michael gun maintenance. The first one was a few days after the storm, it was a quick oiling and storing them in a dry closet where they have been since. Today was a total disassembly, inspection, cleaning, oiling and reassembly.

This is what I found on my 1890 Danzig Gew 1888, this is on the side rail of the receiver/chamber area of it. Had this not been found it would have lead to a catastrophic failure leading to serious injuries. This was last fire in 2018, my one son cleaned it as he was the one who took it to the range.

I always do inspections the night before going to the range, just for reasons like this.

Please if you chose fo shoot these rifles please have them throughly inspected before hand by a qualified and competent gunsmith.

 

[releventchair]

Yikes ff! Good catch.