Aethelred IIs penny?

Volos

Volos

Jr. Member
Oct 12, 2007
23
1
Russia, Moscow region
Detector(s) used
Garrett Master Hunter CX+
Aethelred II's penny?

Good day!
My colleague has recently found this seems-to-be a silver penny of Aethelred II but I cannot find anywhere such a variety with double R in the king’s name on obv. [+EDEL’RREDREXAN] and X in the top left on the rev. A Scandinavian imitation? Reverse: +EDELRI M’O LVN Can LVN stand for Lund, Sweden ???
Can anyone help with this?
The coin was found in Russia. Unfortunately the weight is unknown.
Sear type #1152
 

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Re: Aethelred II's penny?

I brightened them a tad
im not sure the coin named by you is in fact that coin.
im still looking

I think it may be King Knut on the coin
 

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Re: Aethelred II's penny?

folkert said:
As far as I know is LUN = London.
Click to expand...

Yes it is.

I have emailed an expert & will get back to you with the answer, on Monday probably.
 

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Re: Aethelred II's penny?

Who ever put the hole in it did not like the British ruler/Saxons. The head of the ruler is facing down to the feet of the carrier. This was a sign of disrespect which the Saxon's often did with Roman Coins. So it's a 'piece of their own medicine'. This could be evidence of Viking trade, as the Viking were not that keen on the Saxon's.

As you may know this is the period when we were paying huge amounts of money for the Vikings to leave us along. More of these coins are in Sandinavian than in the UK.
 

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Re: Aethelred II's penny?

Yes I can help, email the coin to Mike Bonser, he's an expert on Saxon coins he lives in England. Mike has id plenty of saxon coins for me over the years a few of them Aethelred. His email is [email protected].

Robert.
 

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Re: Aethelred II's penny?

imafishingnutt said:
I think it may be King Knut on the coin
Click to expand...
Is it a joke? :o How could it possibly be Cnut if it’s clearly written Aethelred on the obverse? I have given the full description in my first message with the sides’ legends and the Sear’s catalogue number. +EDEL’RREDREXAN = EDELRED REX AN = Aethelred [Ethelred] the King of England. So what have made you to think of Cnut?
Or d’you mean this is a posthumous issue struck during a Cnut’s reign? It’s very doubtfully too as this (original) particular type was struck in 1003-1009AD, and Aethelred died in 1016AD.

folkert said:
As far as I know is LUN = London.
Click to expand...
Yes, indeed. For those original coins struck in Britain. The question about this ‘mintmark’ arose after a thought of the coin to be a Scandinavian imitation, and Lund perfectly fits.

CRUSADER said:
I have emailed an expert & will get back to you with the answer, on Monday probably.
Click to expand...
Thanks a lot! Let’s wait for an answer.

CRUSADER said:
Who ever put the hole in it did not like the British ruler/Saxons.
Click to expand...
;D ;D It’s NOT the reason! Coins in Russia in 10-11 centuries AD frequently were not used as the means of payment but as jewelry. Necklaces [monistos] made of hundreds of coins :'( were the most popular things and showed the wealth and power of a head of a family in the medieval Russia. Suppose this coin was a part of such a monisto.

robfinds said:
Yes I can help, email the coin to Mike Bonser, he's an expert on Saxon coins he lives in England. Mike has id plenty of saxon coins for me over the years a few of them Aethelred. His email is [email protected].

Robert.
Click to expand...
thanks! I’ll try to contact Mr. Bonser


And thanks for the links, guys! However, I’ve searched a lot myself and did not find this particular variety with double R in the King’s name that forced me to ask here for the help. Can it be still unknown dies variety? 8) 8) ::)
 

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Re: Aethelred II's penny?

"It’s NOT the reason! Coins in Russia in 10-11 centuries AD frequently were not used as the means of payment but as jewelry"

Why did the Russians have the head of the coin pointing downwards? This is a poor placing of the hole if it is to be a nicely balanced piece of jewelry.
 

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Re: Aethelred II's penny?

CRUSADER said:
As you may know this is the period when we were paying huge amounts of money for the Vikings to leave us along. More of these coins are in Sandinavian than in the UK.
Click to expand...
CRUSADER said:
Why did the Russians have the head of the coin pointing downwards? This is a poor placing of the hole if it is to be a nicely balanced piece of jewelry.
Click to expand...
IMHO:
Well, let’s say whoever did this was not aware of the coin origin… ;)
After Vikings got those huge amounts of money from you they had to spend them somehow, didn’t they? So, coming to the Russian lands they traded with locals. As well as severely fought with them which didn’t make the population happy :-\. And considering this coin to be Viking’s the hole was made with all accumulated hate exactly on this place. ::)
Or when you have to hole dozens or even hundreds of coins you won't be choosing a right or wrong place on a coin - you just make a hole and take another one.
 

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Re: Aethelred II's penny?

Volos said:
CRUSADER said:
As you may know this is the period when we were paying huge amounts of money for the Vikings to leave us along. More of these coins are in Sandinavian than in the UK.
Click to expand...
CRUSADER said:
Why did the Russians have the head of the coin pointing downwards? This is a poor placing of the hole if it is to be a nicely balanced piece of jewelry.
Click to expand...
IMHO:
Well, let’s say whoever did this was not aware of the coin origin… ;)
After Vikings got those huge amounts of money from you they had to spend them somehow, didn’t they? So, coming to the Russian lands they traded with locals. As well as severely fought with them which didn’t make the population happy :-\. And considering this coin to be Viking’s the hole was made with all accumulated hate exactly on this place. ::)
Or when you have to hole dozens or even hundreds of coins you won't be choosing a right or wrong place on a coin - you just make a hole and take another one.
Click to expand...

I always thought of the Russians as master craftsmen.

Maybe it was a bracelet & had many coins & in which case it then didn't matter
 

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Re: Aethelred II's penny?

I was just reading an interesting article in a 1992 Western & Eastern Treasure magazine on "holed" coins . At least during Civil War times it was common practice to sew coins on a piece of string or ribbon to keep them from getting lost during battle . I wonder if other cultures did it for that reason .
 

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Re: Aethelred II's penny?

CRUSADER said:
I always thought of the Russians as master craftsmen.

Maybe it was a bracelet & had many coins & in which case it then didn't matter
Click to expand...
1. True! 8)
2. That's what I'm saying! There were many coins on a necklace (or a bracelet if you wish). Can't find now a single picture of one :( but it seems the hole position DID matter those days and I was wrong :-[! I've looked through several available coins and on majority of them a hole is in that place! It appears that coins were in horizontal position on necklaces. I don’t know why but they were. And not only British :D ;)
Here are some pics with holed coins of 10-11 centuries found in Russia:
(German) http://web-collection.ru/collection/44/
(British) http://web-collection.ru/collection/42/
(Eastern/Samanids) http://web-collection.ru/collection/35/page/1/
And here (at the bottom - #2) is a small picture of such a necklace with eastetrn coins:
http://www.rostmuseum.ru/publication/historyCulture/2001/jilina01p05.gif

I’ve never thought of the hole position on coins and why coins were put horizontally. There’s something to find out now! Thanks, CRUSADER!
 

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Re: Aethelred II's penny?

Sorry it took so long he was away from the office. This is from one of the leading UK experts on Saxon Coins:

"An article by H.A. Parsons on 'Symbols and double names on late Saxon
coins', BNJ 17 (1917), pp. 1-74, lists Æthelred II Helmet type pennies
of ten London moneyers with a reverse of this type, having a letter X in
two quarters. This is a coin of an eleventh London moneyer for the
variety, Ethelric. The dies are perfectly normal apart from the added
crosses and the fairly unusual (but by no means uncommon) double RR on
the obverse."
 

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Re: Aethelred II's penny?

Mackaydon said:
Crusader:
"Good Show!" on the research and solution.
Don..
Click to expand...

Thanks I nearly upset him by being too pushy. Very knowledgeable but busy individual. But if you record finds honestly & act that way then people will assist you in times of need.
 

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Hi guys I'd like help with this please if this forum is still active.
I can't see any obvious signs of fake such as WRL . Any help greatly appreciated.Screenshot_20170703-205938.pngScreenshot_20170703-205912.png

Sent from my EVA-L09 using Tapatalk
 

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