Awesome mod for Miners Moss!

[Goodyguy]

Miners Moss (nomad)
often gets a bad rap. Folks complain it gets packed solid too easy, or that gold migrates under or through it and off the end of the sluice, and that it just holds too much worthless material and therefore creates too much concentrate to easily process.

Those are also the reasons why I'm not much of a fan of it's use.

However, there is a simple mod to fix all that .......or so I'm told


The modification to employ when using miners moss (nomad) is to box it into the sluice by adding a solid gate across the exit end of the sluice the same height as the moss or if using expanded metal over the moss then make the gate tall enough to reach the top of it as well

#1 the gate will prevent gold that migrates underneath or through the miners moss from being lost out the end of your sluice.

#2 the gate will keep the miners moss fluidized which will in turn aid in keeping the moss from packing solid.

#3 the fluidized moss will more easily allow the lighter material to wash on down the sluice instead of getting trapped in the moss.

#4 the fluidized moss will more readily trap all sizes of gold.

#5 the fluidized moss will be more efficient at exchanging lights for heavies.

This is not just something that I just dreamed up or made up or sucked out of my thumb.
It is a mod that was passed on to me by a full time miner I met at Thermal city gold camp in North Carolina several years ago that he had learned from another full time miner that had come up with the idea originally.

Since then I have spoken with another miner who swears by the mod and convinced me of it's merit.
Now to be honest, I have not personally tried the mod other than with my experiments building fluid bed gold traps of which all use a boxed in chamber to allow fluidization of material.

It makes perfect sense to me that the mod should do everything as I outlined above without creating anything adverse or negative toward the operation of the sluice box.
In fact just that one simple mod may revolutionize the way certain types of sluices are built once the mod becomes common knowledge.

I was going to keep this mod to myself until I had the chance to test it personally but since I have not been a fan of using miners moss I kept putting it off. I was recently convinced by a fellow miner that uses the mod on his sluices that folks using miners moss need to know about this and the sooner the better.

As far as why I have been avoiding using miners moss in the first place was because of all the negatives that this mod is supposed to eliminate.
Sooner or later I know I will need to re-evaluate my negativity toward the stuff but it's hard for me to go back and revisit something I have long since written off.


Go for the gold,
GG~


* Here is a rough sketch of what I mean......
The red lines indicate a piece of angle aluminum.
The blue arrows indicate where to clamp it onto the sluice so it can easily be removed if needed.
Try different size angles and see what works best.


Left click on drawing to enlarge.

 

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[russau]

good post GG! but i stopped useing MM in my dredge because when i stopped the eng. the cons in the sluice would lockup and when restarting the eng/pump these BS stayed locked up. care needs tobe observed when slowing the eng or starting it backup, because if a person just turns off the eng. without first slowing the idel down, itll wash fine gold down the sluice. and when starting back up, if it isnt ideled back up to speed slowly, youll wash/blast the fine gold out of your box! i went over to Veranda on the advice of John "Hoser" Oates and im glad i did it for my dredges ability to save fine gold. ive built a 2 inch dredge to try out some Gold Hog matting and other materials for a compairison test. this Gold Hog matting looks like its really going to work well.itll be this spring/summer before i can get it out this year.the MM seems that it would/could work fine as long as the operator takes care in slowing/starting up the water flow.but it still holds a lot of cons compaired to the Veranda carpet that ive been useing for 2 years now.

 

[Goodyguy]

I hear you Russ.

I went the carpet route too but have since switched over to the vortex mat as you know. So far I've been very happy with it and have discovered an easy mod that allows the vortex to capture nuggets up to 1/2". I've also found the slow re-start also holds true with carpet or vortex or anything else for that matter when stopping or starting the water flow to prevent gold blow out.

You never see those guys on Gold Rush take care to prevent the blow outs though and I always shudder when I see them do a full blast start up.
When I was using miners moss I would always do a clean up after a shutdown because of the packing of material that occurred upon a shutdown.

Supposedly the packing solid of material does not happen during a shutdown with the gate mod installed because the moss stays fluid not being able to drain dry due to the gate holding the water in the sluice. Of course if the angle is steep enough and the gate is low enough the water would drain over the top of the gate and the top end of the moss would loose fluid. Good reason to build the gate a little higher I suppose.



*The mod to vortex mat that allows it to capture gold nuggets up to 1/2": ........

What you do is decide where you want the nugget traps to be and then take your vortex mat out of the sluice and bend it backwards and carefully using a box cutter with a new blade dipped in soapy water, cut one row off the mat down to the top surface of the belting going all the way across the mat. That will leave you a 3/8" to 1/2" nugget trap between rows, plenty enough to trap nuggets up to 1/2"
*NOTE not all vortex mats are exactly the same, so the trap size after cutting off a row may vary. The one I used for the test left a 1/2" trap. I have another mat that only left a 3/8" trap.

I have thoroughly tested this mod using the vortex mat only, (no riffles no raised expanded metal) in my highbanker that uses a 10" x 48" sluice. I used 4 different size nuggets 1/8", 1/4", 3/8" and 1/2" and the traps caught them all every time. I was running gravel, sand, and dirt material classified to 1/2" and had 4 traps total cut, 1 every 8th row starting with the 8th row from the hopper. After the first run I trimmed a ramp into the front edge of the mat because the nuggets over 1/8" were being stopped from even getting up onto the mat by the thickness of the front edge of the mat.

* Do not trim a ramp into your mat because It's great to have that extra trap.

I used my highbanker for testing because with it I could easily regulate the gpm with the inline ball valve, I tried different gpm's as well as varied sluice angles and even waited until the mat had loaded somewhat before introducing the nuggets.

The traps worked as expected as you will see. The only surprise was that the 1/8" picker would hardly ever make it to the first trap. And none of the nuggets made it to the 4th trap except 1 time when the flow was way too fast and the angle was way too steep.


Best Wishes,
GG~

 

[russau]

Buddy, i concure with this setup! ive done this before and like it!

 

[Jason in Enid]

I confused on how adding a gate at the end will keep the MM fluidized above that tiny level. I guess I need to see a video of this with and without the mod to understand. Is this for a zero angle box?

I stopped using the majority of my MM because it occupied the most of the riffle space. When the riffles were locked down, they pushed down into the MM so far that it lefts large humps in the middle of each space.

 

[Goodyguy]

I confused on how adding a gate at the end will keep the MM fluidized above that tiny level. I guess I need to see a video of this with and without the mod to understand. Is this for a zero angle box?

I stopped using the majority of my MM because it occupied the most of the riffle space. When the riffles were locked down, they pushed down into the MM so far that it lefts large humps in the middle of each space.

That is the reason why most folks use a thin expanded metal between the moss and riffles. And modify the riffle lock down to allow for the thickness of the moss and expanded metal.

I suppose a lesser angle would help keep the MM more fluidized during a shutdown same with a taller gate. Since I have not tried this mod myself I just can not be sure of exactly what happens. Was only going by what I have been told by others. Perhaps I should not have posted the mod until I have tested it for myself. I do believe the mod would stop the migration of fine and flour gold from leaving the sluice from under or through the miners moss.

Hopefully someone who has tried it in person will chime in.

GG~

 

[Timberdoodle]

Great post GG. I use this idea also and it works great. Sometimes I leave a small space between the end of the MM and the sluice lip to create a drop riffle/nugget trap. I think it's a mod that all sluiceboxes could possibly benefit from at some level.

 

[MikeMike]

The gate is a solid piece across the end of the sluice as tall as the top of the expanded metal or minor moss.

It was brought up earlier that the gate either would have to be taller then the upstream riffle or that part of the sluice box would pack up.

If you are having trouble with the moss filling up your riffle area, then you need to either put expanded metal underneath it or get the thicker minor moss instead of the stringy minor mosd in your keene dredge. Or raise your riffle tray up enough to where it is not squeezing everything down so tightly.

 

[KevinInColorado]

The gate is a solid piece across the end of the sluice as tall as the top of the expanded metal or minor moss. It was brought up earlier that the gate either would have to be taller then the upstream riffle or that part of the sluice box would pack up. If you are having trouble with the moss filling up your riffle area, then you need to either put expanded metal underneath it or get the thicker minor moss instead of the stringy minor mosd in your keene dredge. Or raise your riffle tray up enough to where it is not squeezing everything down so tightly.

or just get a different type of sluice ;-)
...sorry I couldn't resist.

 

[omnicron]

Putting vrib or deep vrib will stop the migration under the mm. I noticed in the section of my dredge that I used mm, (1st stage) that the gold was always sitting on the vrib mat. It's really beautiful when you pull the mm and see a golden sheet of vrib matting.

 

[elgatodelnoche]

good post GG! but i stopped useing MM in my dredge because when i stopped the eng. the cons in the sluice would lockup and when restarting the eng/pump these BS stayed locked up. care needs tobe observed when slowing the eng or starting it backup, because if a person just turns off the eng. without first slowing the idel down, itll wash fine gold down the sluice. and when starting back up, if it isnt ideled back up to speed slowly, youll wash/blast the fine gold out of your box! i went over to Veranda on the advice of John "Hoser" Oates and im glad i did it for my dredges ability to save fine gold. ive built a 2 inch dredge to try out some Gold Hog matting and other materials for a compairison test. this Gold Hog matting looks like its really going to work well.itll be this spring/summer before i can get it out this year.the MM seems that it would/could work fine as long as the operator takes care in slowing/starting up the water flow.but it still holds a lot of cons compaired to the Veranda carpet that ive been useing for 2 years now.

Is this Veranda outdoor carpeting? Looking at Home Depot, I can only find indoor Veranda carpeting.

 

[goldgit'r]

I know this is an old thread but I wanted to comment on this.
I talked with Buddy when I was building my trommel,it seems I stumbled upon the gate idea about the same time Buddy did and we discussed it some.
I use it on my 16x48 trommel sluice with 3lb raised expanded and miners moss and it works great.
I do not put anything under the moss and can run all day without a clean up and when I shut down there is still plenty of open area in the moss.
The same holds true for riffles over moss, if your riffles are adjusted so they hold the moss snugly against the bottom of the sluice it serves the same purpose as the gate.

Wes

 

[Sick4gold]

This is a good mod but I want to advise to be careful and pay attention to what sluice you have.
Most newer Proline sluices do not need the gate described OR the ribbed mat under the moss.
Proline sluices are made to pinch the moss very tightly and nothing can migrate under the riffles.
This info was learned 2 separate ways.
1- Jeff from Proline told me this directly. Call it stupid but after reading many many posts about mat under moss I gave it a try anyways just to see my values drop significantly. I found that when there was mat under my moss the moss was too compressed under the riffles and basically eliminated the cavity under the riffle for heavies to back-flow into. Think of putting a heavy pipe on a pillow. The spot where the pipe lays is squished down but the pillow is still bulging everywhere else. This disrupted the low pressure zones behind each riffle and was quite obvious.

If you don't believe me try it for yourself and you will find your self squeezing the buckles and actually bending them to close the riffle gate. It's obvious that it is incorrect.
I have seen a few dredges that worked great with mat under moss and a gate at the end of your sluice is a great idea but make sure you pay attention to how your sluice wants to be run. A gate on an Unmodified Proline sluice doesn't seem to have any advantages as each riffle section seems to be its own separate enclosure once the sluice is closed.
Starting and stopping the water however absolutely will disturb gold. I am a big advocate of trying everything for yourself so I advise getting some decent black sand rows under your riffles and then cutting the water. If you watch closely you will see all of the material under each riffle shift towards the rear of the sluice about 1/4 inch thus disturbing how your heavies are sorted and held.
I try as much as I can from things I read to find out for myself and there is tons of great info on these boards from many people including GG. I still have yet to test out Hosers recommendation for a suction nozzle over a power jet to retain fines but if history is any indication he's probably right.
Excellent mod however for some people however, as always GG delivers!

 

[russau]

Is this Veranda outdoor carpeting? Looking at Home Depot, I can only find indoor Veranda carpeting.

If you buy/use Veranda carpet , ONLY use the non-backed Veranda carpet in your equipment. most of the Home Depot/Lowes types of stores don't carry it. I went to a local carpet store and specified a non-backed Veranda and they got it for me! Plus John Hoser gave me some to try and that's what got me hooked on it! Plus if your riffels/expanded are sqweeshing into the MM , readjust the latching mechinizem for your riffels so that it don't go so deep into the moss! that's what I did before I switched over to Veranda carpet and got rid of my MM.

 

[2cmorau]

i like the MM, but have used Burlap under the moss, then there is a huge dif with a crash box and flair, i do miss my triple, but like my proline

 

[NeoTokyo]

B to the A to the Z to the Double Oh to the K Ahhhhh!

Anywho..... I plan to swap out the carpet on my Yellow Jacket 45 with some Miners Moss, the gate and move the latches up a little more to accommodate the added thickness.
I already have expanded metal so its going to be pretty cheap.

Modding is super easy, all you need is:

1: Miners Moss
2: Drill
3: Rivets and Riveter
4: Sheet aluminum for the gate
5: Aluminum Brazing rods
6: Propane or MAPP gas torch

Easy Peasy.