Watch winder with mixed motifs--can you help with date?

[NJLargeCent]

Found this watch winder on the property of a 1920s house. The town itself was founded in the late 1600s. One side has a colonial lamplighter motif and the other has what appears to be an Egyptian dog (wth palm tree). I don't have any other more zoomed out pics handy, but the top & bottom have the typical small, cut-off stem. The face measures roughly 1/2'' x 1/2''.
Any assistance with dating this would be most appreciated!

 

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[granthansen]

Very interested to hear if anyone has info on this.

 

[reednc]

I see a squirrel with a big bushy tail rather than a dog.

 

[huntsman53]

The picture on the right might be of a standing squirrel eating a nut thus the long tail with the fluffy curl at the end


Frank

 

[DCMatt]

I'm guessing mid 19th C. Hunter and game (squirrel) motif. I saw others on line with deer and rabbits.

DCMatt

P.S. I see I'm 4 minutes too late. As stated by others - squirrel.

 

[NJLargeCent]

I thought it could be a squirrel, too, but the angular contours of the animal speak of an Egyptian dog to me and the tree looks more like a palm tree. The bushy tail and the paws to the mouth (as if eating a nut) certainly connote a squirrel, though. I'll take some better pics when I'm home this evening. I'm hoping it's a squirrel because to me that would keep it to a consistent colonial motif. Thanks for your comments.

 

[artemis moon]

Not to muddy the waters, but I see a fox

 

[huntsman53]

Not to muddy the waters, but I see a fox

It is possible but a fox and most dogs don't sit on their' hind legs with their' front legs in front of them as if eating something! Also, they don't have the ability to hold something in their' paws to eat but a squirrel does.


Frank

 

[NJLargeCent]

I'd give in to the squirrel ID straight away, but looking at the face of the animal under a high magnification, it definitely has prominent dog features and looks nothing like a squirrel. True that the animal is on hind legs and appears to have something in his paws that's round like an acorn. However, the tree is thin and the leaves under magnification appear to be palms. So, it's a bit bizarre nonetheless. I think DCMatt's mid-19th C. date seems accurate given other similar shaped winders I've seen. Thanks for your comments.

 

[huntsman53]

I'd give in to the squirrel ID straight away, but looking at the face of the animal under a high magnification, it definitely has prominent dog features and looks nothing like a squirrel. True that the animal is on hind legs and appears to have something in his paws that's round like an acorn. However, the tree is thin and the leaves under magnification appear to be palms. So, it's a bit bizarre nonetheless. I think DCMatt's mid-19th C. date seems accurate given other similar shaped winders I've seen. Thanks for your comments.

Maybe it's just a squirrel dog! LOL!!! Just funning.

What makes you think it is a tree? It is too small in comparison to the animal to be a tree!


Frank

 

[granthansen]

I think everyone is getting hung up on what it "looks" like. With hieroglyphics, I think there's some, um, artistic license? The thing is, I've searched for dog, squirrel, fox AND hieroglyphics and can't find anything similar. I think if we can dig up a match that'll hold the key, at least to the ID of this varmint.

D.C. Matt, got any examples of any hunter and game motifs? I couldn't find anything there either. That being said, I think your note on age is probably accurate. I found a clock chime hammer not too far from this guy. Attaching a pic for reference.

 

[DCMatt]

D.C. Matt, got any examples of any hunter and game motifs?

DCMatt

 

[NJLargeCent]

Wow, DCMatt, that 1st pic is pretty much dead on and seems to confirm that my piece does in fact feature a squirrel, despite the angular features of the head (and the lean torso). Also, it's too bizarre to have a colonial figure on one side and an Egyptian motif on the other, unless the point is to capture 2 distinct eras. Don't know where you found that pic (I've searched and searched), but well done and thanks!

 

[granthansen]

View attachment 823062

View attachment 823063

DCMatt

You da man!

 

[huntsman53]

NJLargeCent,

Maybe it would be a good idea to post pics showing the whole key front and back! Many of the makers of these had/have their own style and maybe someone who collects or is an expert on key wind pocket watches and their' keys will recognize the style and chime in.


Frank

 

[NJLargeCent]

NJLargeCent,

Maybe it would be a good idea to post pics showing the whole key front and back! Many of the makers of these had/have their own style and maybe someone who collects or is an expert on key wind pocket watches and their' keys will recognize the style and chime in.

Frank

Ok, Frank. Good idea. Here they are...

 

[BuckleBoy]

That is certainly a pre-CW style. I have dug several of that flat style in my antebellum tavern site here in Louisiana. My best guess is Federal period. By the CW, most of the winders were the simple kind with two little loops of brass. I'm sure someone will chime in that they recovered one of this style from a CW camp, but could've been an heirloom watch. It would be interesting to know how many of the loop kind get found in strictly mid-1800s sites. I really think these are older than CW. Open to debate. A great person to ask would be Kuger, since he digs sites with a narrow date range of mid-1800s.

Regards,

Buck

 

[NJLargeCent]

That is certainly a pre-CW style. I have dug several of that flat style in my antebellum tavern site here in Louisiana. My best guess is Federal period. By the CW, most of the winders were the simple kind with two little loops of brass. I'm sure someone will chime in that they recovered one of this style from a CW camp, but could've been an heirloom watch. It would be interesting to know how many of the loop kind get found in strictly mid-1800s sites. I really think these are older than CW. Open to debate. A great person to ask would be Kuger, since he digs sites with a narrow date range of mid-1800s.

Regards,

Buck

Thanks, BB! Great info and always nice to hear a piece is earlier than 1st thought!

 

[kuger]

Thanks B.B.,They do give me the same "Gut feeling",as well....Pre C.W.....I have to be completly honest though,and tell ya I dont know for sure.I have dug watch winders but never fortunate enough to get one with a character on it!Maybe CC Hunter will see this,he will know for sure

 

[BuckleBoy]

Thanks B.B.,They do give me the same "Gut feeling",as well....Pre C.W.....I have to be completly honest though,and tell ya I dont know for sure.I have dug watch winders but never fortunate enough to get one with a character on it!Maybe CC Hunter will see this,he will know for sure

Thanks for your reply Kuger. I am really speaking of the style of winder rather than the characters on it. (Square and flat vs. the round "two tiny brass loop" style.)

Regards,

Buck