Vintage Brass or Copper Pan with Lid

[Breezie]

Hey Gang,
I just bought this old brass (?) copper (?) pan with lid that measures 12 1/2 inches in diameter and 1 1/2 inches tall. As you can see it is marked: U.S. 1383 on the handle. Any help and information on an ID would be appreciated. Thanks, Breezie

 

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[ivan salis]

Re: Old Brass Pan with Lid

well with US on it -- most like govt --military issued stuff -- cooking gear of some type most likely would be my first guess.

 

[ivan salis]

Re: Old Brass Pan with Lid

might have been non military civilain type item --bought and marked after its purchase * -- during the civil war the union army tried several ways of doing "mess" cooking --early on a squad of men would be issued a set of cookwear and take turns as the cook --with each guy doing a turn at mess duty.

it might be from that sort of era.

 

[ivan salis]

Re: Old Brass Pan with Lid

possible it was "modified: had a handle "added"-- might have been a pie holder to begin with * to keep bugs off and the pie fresh -- i can see it as a cornbread pan or for several other uses around a camp fire.

 

[lennon631]

Re: Pan with Lid

I don't know Breezie, I googled it, looked to see if it was a very old patent, that was a dead end, I'm thinking cuz it was etched by hand and it was indeed US gvmnt issue, it is older then CW.

 

[ivan salis]

Re: Pan with Lid

during the civil war everybody and his brother was selling stuff to the us military --of course it had to be "labelled" as us military property in one form or another (to prevent stealing of it for "private use" ) --so the "pie holder" had a handle added and was etched US and most likely 1383 was a sellers contract number or --item order number --like "cook pan , copper, with handle lid 8 in around x 3 in deep - #1383 " or similar -- yes I have dealt with military "ordering" before .

 

[Breezie]

Re: Civil War (?) Brass or Copper Pan with Lid

Ivan & Lennon I think you two are spot on. I've about googled out, and can't find anything that even resembles this pan & lid. I would think there would be at least one other something similar to it, and hope this does not turn out to be another 'egg counter' ID. LOL

 

[Monty]

Re: Civil War (?) Brass or Copper Pan with Lid

I would guess that is a military inventory number? Monty

 

[Tony in SC]

Re: Civil War (?) Brass or Copper Pan with Lid

This is one of the strangest that you have put up lately. I don't think it would be a military cooking pan. There's no handle on the pan. It's small like a cake pan,,but why the lid. There's lead solder all over. All the old army cookware that I have is stamped. This one is engraved? I don't think the military would issue copper cook ware, copper was too valuable. I would say that it is very old and it came from a higher class kitchen (or a lab) and the number is a patent no. Other than that I don't have a clue. Tony

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Civil War (?) Brass or Copper Pan with Lid

Are there any hand soldered seams on the pan? ...or is it all one piece machine made?

 

[coin1921]

Re: Civil War (?) Brass or Copper Pan with Lid

Could be a modified movie film container

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Civil War (?) Brass or Copper Pan with Lid

It doesnt look as if it was cooked in much or is that just me? Do you see any scouring marks?

It may not be for cooking at all.

 

[daroofa]

Re: Civil War (?) Brass or Copper Pan with Lid

Maybe a vintage geology tool.

http://www.forestry-suppliers.com/drilldown_pages/view_category.asp?cat=309

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Civil War (?) Brass or Copper Pan with Lid

Maybe a vintage geology tool.

It does look more like thin brass or bronze. The rivet looks like copper.

Notice how the cover fits inside. I think daroofa got it.

We have a geologist member. Ill email him.

 

[mick56]

Re: Civil War (?) Brass or Copper Pan with Lid

Probably not for cooking. Don't think the solder would last long.

 

[Breezie]

Re: Civil War (?) Brass or Copper Pan with Lid

Tony & BCH, Yes, strange things do have a tendency to follow me home! I just bought it this morning on auction, so I haven't seen it in person yet, and the pics I posted were taken by the past owner. Yes, I do see solder, but its on the lip, and from the pics I don't think there is a seam; looks like a solid piece. Actually, I don't even know if it is copper or brass, but it was advertised as brass, so I am assuming the seller had some knowledge.

DaRoofa, I don't think it is a geology sieve pan because it is too short and shallow for that; only 1 1/2 inches tall. I've seen those in person and although it resembles it, it's the wrong size.

Coin, the movie reel pans I've seen didn't have a handle so they could be stored side by side flat.

Is it possible as Ivan said, it could be some type of mess plate/server and not used for cooking, but for storing food? It just seems strange to be what looks like 'mammy made' engraving with the U.S.

As always, thanks to all, Breezie

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Civil War (?) Brass or Copper Pan with Lid

The engraving looks unprofessional. My guess an inventory number.

 

[Breezie]

Re: Civil War (?) Brass or Copper Pan with Lid

The engraving looks unprofessional. My guess an inventory number.

BCH, I agree, the engraving is unprofessional, but why would a general merchandize company engrave an inventory number on an item unless it was the military?

Wonder if 1383 was a regiment, troop, sqaudron,etc. Breezie

 

[batcap]

Re: Civil War (?) Brass or Copper Pan with Lid

I really have to throw my vote in with daroofa. I used those ASTM graduated sieves for several years as a soils technician. Between the cover and the pan you could have as many as 8 sieves in decreasing hole sizes as you went down. The largest we used was a 3/4", and soils would work their way down to the fineness of a nylon stocking. The stuff that made it into the pan would be further sorted by putting a set amount in a graduated cylinder with water and shaken. The rate of change of density as the fine soil settled would be measured with a hydrometer.

And this is the first time I've posted here where I actually know what I'm talking about.

Google image search: ASTM Testing Sieves

 

[BuckleBoy]

Re: Civil War (?) Brass or Copper Pan with Lid

I think that with a number ENGRAVED in it with an engraving tool rather than STAMPED in, you're looking at Much later than CW. My vote is mid-20th c.

I have not seen any CW relics in my recollection that had part/stock/or ID numbers on them. And before the buckle folks chime in, that is not a bench mark. Bench marks were stamped.

Let's not sensationalize, folks. Not everything is CW.

The construction of the one in question differs from the construction of all the mid-1800s brass or copper kettles I've found and seen.