✅ SOLVED Two dogs a crown and coat of arms on this button. What is it?

[Ammoman]

Hi everyone. I found this today at a pretty old home site.
Any ideas on its age? I suspect it is civilian and maybe British but want to be sure.


As you can see...the backmark is not normal.

Did a little more cleaning on it.


Thanks in advance for your input.

 

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[Bigcypresshunter]

I cant remember but I think one side is a lion

 

[Ammoman]

The extra detail makes me think the dog on the left is leaning against a bomb? Maybe ww1?

 

[Ammoman]

I cant remember but I think one side is a lion

At first i thought lion as well...but they look like dogs to me...almost like the dogs from the Egyptian hieroglyphs .

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

With the new picture, it looks like 2 dogs. I have seen similar crest/crowns with a lion and a unicorn. Looks like a one piece cast shank

 

[CRUSADER]

Unlikely to be British. The Crown is the biggest give-a-way. The quality & metal type screams 20th C blazer button to me. What is a little odd is the letters on the reverse, are they part of the crudely casted mould? Or incised after manufacture?

 

[Ammoman]

Unlikely to be British. The Crown is the biggest give-a-way. The quality & metal type screams 20th C blazer button to me. What is a little odd is the letters on the reverse, are they part of the crudely casted mould? Or incised after manufacture?

I was hoping the crown would lead me to a country of origin but you are right. I don't think it is British. And those letters...they were a surprise!

I just purchased a button book from Ebay so maybe i will be able to ID it from the info the book gives. Thank you for your input Crusader.

 

[TheCannonballGuy]

Ammoman wrote:
> I just purchased a button book from Ebay so maybe i will be able to ID it from the info the book gives.

Although the emblem at the top of your coat-of-arms button is a form of headgear which shows the person's rank, it is not a crown... it is a coronet. Insofar as I'm aware, you never see a coronet on a Military button. Coronets were worn by members of a European country's Nobility... which isn't Royalty.

There were several forms of Nobility coronet, differing mostly in the number of "knobs" or diamond-shapes or other things on top of the coronet's multiple upward projections. Your button appears to show 7 knobs... which if I recall correctly represents the Nobility rank of Viscount. The rank of Count has 9, Earl has 5, and Lord has 4. Some other ranks are Duke and Baron.

Buttons which show one of the Nobility versions of coronet are almost always Livery buttons. Unless the button-book you bought shows Livery buttons, you won't find your button in it.

 

[cw0909]

maybe this site can help ID your livery button
https://sites.google.com/site/liverybuttonsidentified/home

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I used to be good at identifying these types as fashion, career uniform or military by using the Waterbury site. Type your search word(s) like crown, crest, shield, scroll or dog into the search top right. They have been making buttons since 1812 and bought out many designs.

These buttons came with the search "dog". https://www.waterburybutton.com/search


The search is not that good so you will have to try numerous variations and keep it simple. I didnt get anything on coronet but there are 17 pages of crown. Its worth a shot IMO. https://www.waterburybutton.com/search
Type "crown" or "crest" into the quick search and hit GO..

 

[Ammoman]

Mystery solved! I did some more cleaning on the back of the button and found the letters on the back spell "Lidz"


A google search lead me to a company called Lidz bros out of NYC. I believe they are a costume jewelry maker founded in 1895 and were at their peak in the mid 50's

So, this is likely a button for the fashion industry of the late 40's or 50's.


Thanks so much for all your help!

Will mark as solved.

 

[CRUSADER]

Ammoman wrote:
> I just purchased a button book from Ebay so maybe i will be able to ID it from the info the book gives.

Although the emblem at the top of your coat-of-arms button is a form of headgear which shows the person's rank, it is not a crown... it is a coronet. Insofar as I'm aware, you never see a coronet on a Military button. Coronets were worn by members of a European country's Nobility... which isn't Royalty.

There were several forms of Nobility coronet, differing mostly in the number of "knobs" or diamond-shapes or other things on top of the coronet's multiple upward projections. Your button appears to show 7 knobs... which if I recall correctly represents the Nobility rank of Viscount. The rank of Count has 9, Earl has 5, and Lord has 4. Some other ranks are Duke and Baron.

Buttons which show one of the Nobility versions of coronet are almost always Livery buttons. Unless the button-book you bought shows Livery buttons, you won't find your button in it.

I knew it wasn't a Livery button even with the coronet style crown, didn't have the quality.

 

[CRUSADER]

Mystery solved! I did some more cleaning on the back of the button and found the letters on the back spell "Lidz"


A google search lead me to a company called Lidz bros out of NYC. I believe they are a costume jewelry maker founded in 1895 and were at their peak in the mid 50's

So, this is likely a button for the fashion industry of the late 40's or 50's.
View attachment 1707661

Thanks so much for all your help!

Will mark as solved.

Yeap, just as I thought, its was just a sudo-coat-of-arms. Just the first type I had seen with such an odd makers-mark!

 

[Ammoman]

Yeap, just as I thought, its was just a sudo-coat-of-arms. Just the first type I had seen with such an odd makers-mark!

You nailed it on your first response!

Until I found this button, a coat of arms was just a design with no meaning. BOY WAS I WRONG! I learned alot from this find.