Strange coin found at Indian campsite

[gixxering]

I found this with my Garrett ace 250 and have no idea what this is any help is much appreciated. I am so used to clad and this was a great change. I found this in western NC in a garden in the mountains. I have no idea why this coin would be in NC and in the mountains.

dave

 

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[LadyDigger]

I could be wrong, but the description that this person found on his coin sounds almost like yours....here's the link: http://en.allexperts.com/q/Coin-Collecting-2297/Pieces-eight.htm

That's a cool looking coin, never saw one like that before! Great Find!
Annmarie

PS: here's a link about the area this coin may be from: http://www.viajesoaxaca.com/english/quienes.html

 

[Gypsy Heart]

Mexico Oaxaca Revolution 8 Reales

 

[Mackaydon]

Mexican: War of Independence, Insurgentes Issues
Morelos 8 reales--copper. (inscribed 'JMO' for Jose Moreles; and 'SUD'-denoting the Army of the South)
The majority of these (copper) coins were in the form of IOUs to be redeemed for silver or gold after the war--subject to achieving victory. All cast copper coins are 'suspect'.
Issued between 1811 and 1814, inclusively; 38-39 mm. dia.
Don.........
Source: Grove (1981); page 175

 

[Felinepeachy]

YOWZA!! That is awesome!

 

[SilverFinger]

http://www.mexrepguy.com/hp_coins6.html

 

[Old Dog]

Superb example !
I like that coin, definitely on my wish list.

Thanks for sharing
Thom

 

[Gilligan]

Great find, but additionally, the big question is......how much is it worth

 

[Glenns5900]

The other one is a nickel

 

[Old Dog]

Pretty good Glenn,

A most astute observation.

LOL
Thom

 

[Rob66]

Very cool looking coin.Intresting too.

 

[GL]

Yours has a row of dots under the bow, the ones in the links don't.
The "plain field" version linked has no dots(top picture below).
Maybe send a picture or two to that site and see what they think.

 

[bradyboy]

When I looked up the coin on the right says it should be worth about .05, hope this helps
lol

 

[Mackaydon]

As Grove ("Coins of Mexico") notes, there are many varieties in the Morelos coinage (perhaps one had dots under the bow) and, again, in the words of Grove: "All cast copper coins are suspect".

Gypsy: As to being an Oaxaca 8-reales, I believe the Oaxaca 8-reales coin was not minted until 1814 and it had the initials 'OXA' under 'SUD'. The OXA coin was also a slightly smaller measuring 37 mm versus 39mm for the plain field, non-OXA 8-reales.
Don.....

 

[Gypsy Heart]

Found this interesting.....
In October 1810, Miguel Hidalgo commissioned José María Morelos to organize an army in the south of the country. Morelos became the leader of the insurgent movement after the capture of Hidalgo in March 1811. With Morelos, the insurrection was transformed; he managed to unite the ideas of intermediary groups with the demands of the people, and he proclaimed for the first time non-subjection to the Bourbon monarchy.

The copper coins ordered by Morelos were equivalent to promises of payment. In other words, they could be exchanged for their face value in gold and silver coins upon the triumph of the revolution. Thus, for the first time fiduciary currency was used in Mexico. The obverse of these roughly manufactured coins bore a Morelos monogram along with the denomination and mint year. On the back, a bow and arrow appears, and underneath them, the word “SUD” (“SOUTH”). There were two main variants: A plain one, and another with profuse floral adornment. They were produced in eight, two, one, and half-real coins.

After the siege of Cuautla, Morelos spent several months in Tehuacán. When he left the city, he put the insurgent Manuel Mier y Terán in charge. It is believed that, in the assumption of minting responsibilities, Mier y Terán manufactured a coin type with the initials “T. C.” between the bow and the word “SUD.” These coins had a finer finish, whether due to more adequate machinery or more experienced workers. Several researchers believe the letters “T.C.” mean that the minting took place in Tierra Caliente. Others agree that the abbreviation means Tlacotepec, and still others, Torres de Cuautla. The most common coins of this type were eight-real coins; the rarest are those of two reales and those of half a real.

On November 25, 1812, Morelos attacked and conquered Oaxaca. He found a large quantity of silver bars there, allowing him to resume his mintings, both the “SUD” coins and a variety similar to the provisional Oaxaca coins. The mintings done in Oaxaca were Morelos' most important. Not only was the quantity large, but also the types, varieties and values were numerous. The coins were manufactured in silver and copper, both smelted and minted.

Although the Morelos coin type is quite uniform, there are several varieties due to the fact that the mintings took place in different locations (Tecpan, Huautla, Oaxaca, Acapulco, Tlacotepec, Chilpancingo, Cerro de Atijo, and Tehuacán). Despite research on this subject, we can only conjecture on the mint types, and there is no complete registry of the varieties. The key features of the Morelos coin design are the monogram on the front and the bow and arrow on the back. The monogram bears the letters “M O S,” Morelos’ initials. This feature seems to have undergone a transition from the plain letter “M,” to “JM,” to “JMo,” to “SMo.” But it is impossible to confirm that such a transition took place in that order.

http://www.bancodemexico.gob.mx/sit...nufactFeaturesHistory/historyMexicanCoin.html

 

[Ramitt]

Thanks for the History Gypsy, it always makes these post more interesting and I learn something new.

 

[Mackaydon]

Morelos played a significant role in the Mexican War of Independence (1810-1821).

As Gypsy stated above, following the death of Hidalgo y Costilla, Morelos assumed leadership of the revolutionary army. "Under his leadership the cities of Oaxaca and Acapulco were occupied. In 1813, the Congress of Chilpancingo was convened and on November 6 the Congress signed the first official document of independence. In 1815, Morelos was captured by Spanish colonial authorities and executed for treason on December 22." (Wiki)

"The two main types of Morelos coinage are plain field and grapevine. The term, floreated, or flowered, used by some authors is not correct. There are no flowers, only the stylized leaves (and sometimes bunches) of grapes." (Grove-page 174).

The dated Morelos coinage occurred between 1811 and 1814. The Morelos-Oaxaca coinage (marked 'OXA' under 'SUD') began in 1812 (2-reales). The 4-reales in 1813 and the 8-reales in 1814. I'm unaware of any Morelos coins were minted in Mexico and dated 1815.
Trivia question: Were any coins minted in Mexico between 1815 and 1821? Mexico's first Emperor, Ituribide coins first appeared in 1822, but what coinage preceded his, if any, during the years 1815-1821. (I don't know the answer.)
Don........