SB 868 DOES !!! make it illegal to take or ATTEMPT to take a cob from the beach

[hobbit]

I don't mean to Hi-jack a thread, but just wanted to sound the alarm bell a little louder because signumops' original thread is getting long and some members are poo-pooing this thing.
The bill clearly states that it is illegal to "take or ATTEMPT to take" an "archaeological specimen" from "State Sovereignty Submerged Lands". Here is the definition of "State Sovereignty Submerged Lands" from the Florida Department of Environmental Protection website:


Sovereignty Submerged Lands

Sovereignty submerged lands include, but are not limited to, tidal lands, islands, sandbars, shallow banks and lands waterward of the ordinary or mean high water line, beneath navigable fresh water or beneath tidally-influenced waters.


This is the PUBLIC BEACH, folks. This bill will make it illegal to take a cob or ATTEMPT to take a cob from the PUBLIC BEACH. The beach in question DOES NOT have to be designated an "archaeological site", either. It does not technically make it illegal to "just" metal detect on the beach, but what if you are detecting for modern jewlery and a cob comes up in your scoop? The term "ATTEMPT" in this piece of totalitarian monstrosity is the scariest thing of all.

 

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[Tom_in_CA]

Right, then how would you be "attemping" to "find a cob", if you're there looking for the boyscout ring your dad lost there when he was a kid? Or the car keys your wife lost there yesterday? Heck, aren't people using detectors to find meteorites nowadays? Cob? what cob? I haven't found any cobs, have you?

 

[cornelis 816]

I am a foreighner but I am amazed that you Floridians are taking all this BS . Are'nt you guys ashamed of yourselves . Is this the America I immigrated to many years ago . Is this the America I raised my kids . You guys better get on the ball and do something . I don"t know what you are going to do . Certainly you guys have some power left . DO SOMETHING . Let these guys know who is in charge . Cornelius

 

[hobbit]

Tom, I lived in San Diego for many years and have read lots of your posts with great interest. I was born in Pensacola, though, and can tell you one thing for certain: when it comes to enforcement, authorities in some parts of Florida (like the Treasure Coast and the Keys) will not simply "disregard" this statute. I am not saying that the Brown Shirts are going to harrass every old man swinging an Excal on the beach...but they WILL do it sometimes, in some places and to some people. Florida is NOT California!!! People talk about "big government" in California, but California Law Enforcement types are not nearly as draconian in enforcement matters as they are in Florida. They are afraid of being accused of violating people's rights and winding up in court themselves. California's "leftyness" is a two way street. There is a wide streak of good 'ole REACTIONARY in some branches of Florida Law enforcement. The courts are generally more conservative and more likely to side with the authorities. If this bill were in California, it would not bother me. I would take it with a grain of salt. I guarantee if this legislation passes, being seen with a metal detector in certain parts of Florida is going to get you an interview with a cop...and you better not have a cob in your pocket or you are probably going to go to jail. Look at what the bill CHANGES from the old statute. Almost nothing EXCEPT that it extends what is currently criminal in regards to removing or attempting to remove an archaeological specimen to include ALL public land in the state. And it leaves interpretation up to the local authorities. And that once in a lifetime find we all dream of...you can kiss it goodby because now your provenance will get you arrested and your find confiscated by the BAR.

 

[hobbit]

here is the official summary of what changes in the Florida statutes under the revised bill:

"Currently, Florida law prohibits persons from conducting archaeological field investigations on, or removing or attempting to remove, or deface, destroy, or otherwise alter any archaeological site or specimen located upon any land owned or controlled by the state or within the boundaries of a designated state archaeological landmark or landmark zone, except under the authority of a permit granted by the Division of Historical Resources (Division). Persons engaging in these activities can face criminal penalties, administrative fines, and the forfeiture of any collected materials.
CS/SB 868 expands the area where unauthorized archaeological activity is prohibited to include state sovereignty submerged land and land owned by political subdivisions, and authorizes the Division to issue permits for archaeological research at these locations.
This bill substantially amends ss. 267.12 and 267.13 of the Florida Statutes."

Bear in mind that "state sovereignty submerged land" includes all tidelands from the HIGH water mark seaward. This is ALL the wet sand on every beach in the state of Florida.
Bear in mind that "land owned by political subdivisions" is any land owned by any city, county or state agency. That includes EVERY PUBLIC PARK and EVERY PUBLIC SCHOOL in the State of Florida.
Bear in mind that an "archaelogical specimen" is anything more than 50 years old. It is illegal to "take or attempt to take" a 1961 Lincoln Memorial Cent from any beach or park or river or lake in the state of Florida under this statue.
I wonder how long the 1715 lease sites will be safe...

 

[digsallday]

Hobbit take it easy. If you find a cobb [and this is IF you find a cobb]kick it to the parking lot.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

digsallday: right. I never find coins over 49 yrs. old anyways. All my coins that you'll see in my apron, if you care to look, "I'll be happy to show you mr. authority personell man", are all going to be 49 years or newer!

 

[hobbit]

Have you ever read the story about the old lady who found the 1715 presentation piece at Sebastian Inlet State Park in 1989? It is just one story. There are many more.
Will the next person who makes a remarkable find on the Treasure Coast be able to tell their story?
Digsallday, I don't share your pessimism about the possibility of finding a cob. When conditions are right, they are there to be found if you know where to look. I will not even comment on the "parking lot" suggestion.
I don't live on the Treasure Coast, but I watch the surf reports, and when things look good, I try to make it down. Should I go anymore?
Tom, when I detect, I just like to do it legally. It somehow adds to the enjoyment of the experience. I guess I am just funny that way.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

hobbit, I too would prefer that all laws favor us. I'm not saying that my comments are the "preferred" way to go about things. I truly hope this junk doesn't pass either for you guys