Odyssey Marine Exploration sinks after judge rules $500 million treasure belongs

[Mudpie]

Odyssey sinks as judge rules loot belongs to Spain
Odyssey Marine Exploration sinks after judge rules $500 million treasure belongs to Spain.

Too bad, Odyssey should at least be paid its expenses.

NEW YORK (AP) -- Shares of Odyssey Marine Exploration Inc. sank Thursday after a federal court said on Wednesday the shipwreck-exploration company should return $500 million worth of treasure from a sunken Spanish warship to Spain.
Related Quotes
Symbol Price Change
OMEX 2.27 -1.60
Chart for Odyssey Marine Exploration, Inc
{"s" : "omex","k" : "c10,l10,p20,t10","o" : "","j" : ""}

Odyssey's shares nearly halved, to $2.04, down $1.83, in morning trading, bottoming at a nearly six-year low of $1.39 earlier in the session.

Federal magistrate judge Mark Pizzo recommended the Tampa, Fla.-based company return the 500,000 gold and silver coins to the Spanish government.

Odyssey said Wednesday it would file a written objection to the decision. Another federal judge will consider the recommendation and decide.

The Tampa, Fla.-based company had discovered the 17 tons of loot, popularly known as the "Black Swan" treasure, in the Atlantic Ocean in May 2007.

Spain filed a claim in federal court in Tampa stating that the treasure came from a Spanish ship, the Nuestra Senora de las Mercedes, which was sunk by the British navy during a sea battle off the southwest coast of Portugal in 1804.

Odyssey had countered that there wasn't enough evidence to prove the ship was the Mercedes, and that it found only the sunken ship's treasures, not the ship itself.

But the judge said he believes there is enough evidence to confirm that the site of the treasure was that of the Mercedes, and both the vessel and cargo sunk with it are subject to sovereign immunity, Odyssey said.

The principle of sovereign immunity states that naval vessels remain the property of the nation that flagged them, regardless of where they lie and how much time has passed.

"I'm very surprised," said Odyssey Chief Executive Greg Stemm in a statement Wednesday. "Odyssey has done everything by the book."

* Email
* IM
* Bookmark
* del.i

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

How to Research for Treasure Hunting and Metal Detecting From Lead Generation to Vetting - Grab it through Amazon!

[Treasure-Diver]

I would dump every last coin back into the 3500 foot deep before I turned it over to Spain. I'm sorry but I feel if a company puts the effort into locating a treasure over 200 years old they own it. Where has the Spanish government been for 200 years? Why don't you ever hear of a country finding a treasure like this? Because they aren't looking for it! They wait till a professional and/or amateur treasure hunter finds it then Everyone wants a piece of it. And states and governments wonder why no one wants to report valuable finds, heck they aren't even willing to share they want it all with no work what so ever. Lose lips sink ships. Thanks for listening to my rant.

 

[ivan salis]

ok it belongs to spain --fine then put it back - exactly like you found it --scattered all over the sea floor at the cords . and let spain recover it --or else let them pay the "full" total cost of the "recovery" --- sorry but there is no "free lunch" folks -- Odyssey did do all the work and spending -- now spain is to get all that work for free? --- sorry folks but in my veiw not right by any way or means you want to figger it by --Odyssey at minimum should get "full reimburment" of all research and recovery cost at the very least for the "recovery" of it. --as a "finding and recovery" fee. or they should "dump" it exactly where they found back in the sea . -- thus "replacing" spains property right were it came from .

 

[SebastianSam]

There are certain individuals who already made out very nicely, whether the coins are ultimately retained by Odyssey or not.

It will be interesting to see if the ruling is changed after Odyssey's objection.

If the ruling is not changed, and Odyssey is not reimbursed for all of their expenses, I would do exactly as Treasure-Diver said, throw all the damn coins back to the bottom of the sea. Tom Gurr did the same thing many years ago on the 1733 fleet!

 

[jeff k]

Odyssey Provides Additional Update on "Black Swan" Case
Thursday June 4, 2009, 3:38 pm EDT

TAMPA, Fla.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Since the announcement of the Magistrate’s recommendation in the “Black Swan” case, intense international media coverage has led to many questions that Odyssey Marine Exploration, Inc. (NASDAQ:OMEX - News) would like to address.

What was this recent court filing by the Magistrate?

This was not a ruling in the case. The recent filing was a recommendation by U.S. Federal Court Magistrate Mark A. Pizzo that Spain’s Motion to Dismiss the “Black Swan” case be granted. The recommendation which was filed June 3, 2009, opines that the Court lacks jurisdiction to hear the case. Odyssey and any other interested parties may file written objections to the recommendation before any ruling is issued, and Odyssey intends to file an objection.

How do you feel about the recommendation?

While we respect the Magistrate’s experience, judges are not infallible, as evidenced by the multitude of verdicts that are overturned each year in appellate court. We believe key pieces of evidence were ignored or discounted that show the Mercedes WAS clearly on a commercial mission when she sank and that the majority of cargo (coins) aboard the ship was owned by PRIVATE individuals, not the government. “Returning” the coins to the Spanish Government when they never owned them defies logic and reason. We also disagree with the Magistrate’s apparent assumption that a vessel was found at the site. Furthermore, the Magistrate accepted facts as presented by Spain without giving Odyssey an opportunity to cross examine witnesses at a trial.

Do you plan to appeal if the Magistrate’s recommendations are followed by the Judge when he makes his ruling?

Yes. This recommendation is far from the end of the “Black Swan” case. We believe that the judge or the appellate court will see the legal and evidentiary flaws in Spain’s claim, and we’ll be back to argue the merits of the case. We will continue to vigorously defend our rights to what we have legally recovered and submitted to the jurisdiction of the Court.

Does this mean the case will drag on even longer?

This does not have a significant impact on our timelines or legal plans. We fully expected Spain to file an appeal if their Motion to Dismiss was denied, and so we have been planning and budgeting for an appeal in the case.

Are the other claimants in the case planning to object as well?

While we presume that the claimants in the case who assert ownership rights by virtue of the fact that their ancestors owned a portion of the cargo will join us in objecting, we cannot comment for them or for Peru.

Does this affect your current operations?

No, our shipwreck operations continue to be focused in the “Atlas” search area with both of our ships working in the English Channel. We also have been planning additional operations for 2009 in other areas of the world.

Does this affect your plans for an HMS Victory agreement?

No. We are continuing to work cooperatively with the UK Government toward a negotiated agreement as stated in the filing by their attorneys. As demonstrated by our partnering agreement on the shipwreck of HMS Sussex, a sovereign immune British warship, we have a history of working cooperatively with the UK Government. An overview of this agreement is available at www.shipwreck.net/pam.

How does this affect your balance sheet?

It does not have any effect on our balance sheet. The “Black Swan” coins were never treated as assets on our balance sheet.

Does this recommendation mean you will be changing your business model?

No. This particular situation is unique and our portfolio of potential shipwreck targets includes many merchant wrecks more like the SS Republic where there are no government ownership issues. In the case of the SS Republic, we obtained title to the shipwreck and its cargo less than eight months after the discovery of the shipwreck site.

There are also other governments who are open to cooperating with Odyssey, and who are enthusiastic about our potential partnership proposals. Our model is especially attractive in today’s economic climate, because we use no taxpayer money and fund recovery, archaeology, conservation and education.

What other shipwreck projects are you working on?

We currently have two ships working in the “Atlas” search area utilizing new technology integrated into the ZEUS platform which are expected to enhance search and inspection capabilities. Operations aboard Odyssey Explorer are currently being filmed for the Discovery Channel series “Treasure Quest.”

The “Atlas” search area contains at least five high value targets, one of which, HMS Victory, was located last year by Odyssey. We are continuing to search for the other high value targets and we are conducting additional operations intended to help identify a site already located.

We plan to resume work on the North Carolina project later this year. Shipwreck exploration firm and Odyssey partner, Intersal, Inc. has received a renewal of its exploration permit from the North Carolina Department of Cultural Resources for a site off the coast of North Carolina and additional surrounding areas, some of which correlate with Odyssey's “Firefly” shipwreck project. Odyssey has an agreement with Intersal, Inc. to pursue operations under this permit and to share in substantial research and data acquired by Intersal over the years relating to the target shipwreck and the work completed to date in the permit area.

The area covered by this permit and arrest is located near Odyssey's current “Firefly” project, which was acquired by Odyssey from BDJ Discovery Group in 2007 and includes one arrested site that has already produced a small number of gold and silver artifacts. The Intersal site and permit area may also be related to the high-value, Colonial-era merchant vessel believed to be located in the area. The agreements with BDJ and Intersal are similar but separate and the areas do not overlap.

In addition we have several other shipwreck projects in development which may lead to operations in 2009.

 

[G.I.B.]

Where did Spain get the coins in the first place?

Why is that country not claiming the treasure?

 

[MORE AND BEYOND OSSY]

Where did Spain get the coins in the first place?

Why is that country not claiming the treasure?

Peru did not exist at the time

 

[4theMoney]

The people of Peru did. Do they not matter? The Jews were picked on by the Nazis, but they were just people. They matter dont they? Once again I ask if we were to invade Spain and change its name would it not matter what crimes were commited?

 

[G.I.B.]

Where did Spain get the coins in the first place?

Why is that country not claiming the treasure?

Peru did not exist at the time

Then I am confused.

Spain claims ownership of the treasure as decedents of the people / governing entity, who owned the ship at the time.

Are there no decedents of the Peruvian people / governing entity, who may also lay claim to the treasure?

 

[MORE AND BEYOND OSSY]

4theMoney, The people of Peru do matter more that bit's of silver and gold. If the coins get sold, which
I don't think will happen, Give it all the to the world's poor, of all nation's
Ossy
PS I love the picture of your dog

 

[MORE AND BEYOND OSSY]

Where did Spain get the coins in the first place?

Why is that country not claiming the treasure?

Peru did not exist at the time

Then I am confused.

Spain claims ownership of the treasure as decedents of the people / governing entity, who owned the ship at the time.

Are there no decedents of the Peruvian people / governing entity, who may also lay claim to the treasure?

It was a Spanish State, under Spanish rule.

 

[Newt]

This is why you keep everything confidential. Sad. If Spain wanted it so bad, they should have been looking for it.
Newt

 

[G.I.B.]

[/quote] It was a Spanish State, under Spanish rule.
[/quote]

Voluntarily, or by an occupational force?

I would think that it would make a difference as to the true ownership of the treasure. If the locals agreed and were ruled by the Spanish voluntarily, then it is Spain's property. If they were conquered under acts of aggression, then it would belong to the descendants of the people who were there at the time of the pillaging.

It's my simplistic common sense approach.

 

[ivan salis]

the spanish have the same "rights" to claim the "defeated" enslaved indain forced labor mined silver taken from a area that at that time was "under spain's military control" to be exploited as they liked --- just about as much right as germany had to claim all the french national art treasures taken from france during WW 2 by the NAZI 'S --- SINCE FRANCE WAS "UNDER GERMAN MILITARY CONTROL " at the time the items were taken as "booty" of war. (pilliaging the defeated country --- an old european custom)

in todays modern world --- the world at large did not allow the nazi's theft to stand for the french art works of WW2 taken by force of arms (when found they are to be "returned")---- but since the raping and pillaging of what is now days modern peru happened so long ago its ok now ? humm sliding standards huh? --- if its not the salvors who did all the work to recover it. --then it belongs to the opppressed folks it was stolen from using them as forced slave labor in the first place --- spain should not profiet from its acts in this matter --its morally wrong to allow them to have it --it "pays" them today for past "bad acts"

spain wants to cry "cultural heritage" - ie the "spanish heritage" is that of being theifs of silver and gold resources of others -- enslaving them and using them as forced labor to mine and give over to spain their valuible metal resources until such a time as they finally drove spain out.

peru's "cultural heritage" is that of being "exploited"---by spain for spain's enrichment --thus money is owed by spain to atone for "bad past" acts of looting and pillaging -- spains share of this money would make a nice "start" on the atonement money

if your great great great grandfather (mr spain) robbed a house (owned by mr peru) and while in riding away going back to his house mr spain somehow lost the gold and silver coins --- and say 300 years later the gold and silver coins were found by strangers (mr odyssey)-- would not by legal rights the money belong to the grandkids of the person it was stole from (mr peru)-- and not the grandkids of the robber? ( mr spain) --and wouldn't mr odyssey deserve a "finders fee or reward"

 

[MORE AND BEYOND OSSY]

Re: Odyssey Marine Exploration sinks after judge rules $500 million treasure bel

Ivan, I wonder what you would have said if Odyseey would have got the decision? Would you be
as vocal for the people of Peru as you now, Or who cares if Odyssey had won ! I don't remember
Greg saying he was going to share any of the loot with anyone do you?
Ossy

 

[ivan salis]

if Odyssey had won vs spain -- of course the people of peru have the legal right to put forth a claim (they still do in my view--no matter who wins- as part of THEIR stolen culturial historical items* )--peru by todays world's --"proper view point" ie " modern standards" in my veiw has much better and just claim to the treasure than spain does--- of course as the finders and recoverers who have made "possible" the return of these "historically important" items to peru -- Odyssey would of course deserve a large "find and recovery fee" or % of the find -- because otherwise it would still just be "lost" on the bottom -- unreachible and unfound by the people of peru.

no matter who wins -- Odyssey at the minimum deserves all their "costs" paid --- the full costs of all the research , recovery and conservation of these items paid for bring it off the bottom and preserving it . -- no matter who "gets" it in the end --because theres no such a thing as a --- "free" lunch .

 

[maximushisp]

Re: Odyssey Marine Exploration sinks after judge rules $500 million treasure bel

I'ts funny to read any of you talking about Spain and the Spanish.
I hope that the coins return soon to Spain.

Maximus

 

[hmmm]

on Vancouver island there is a lost tunnel that was made by the Spanish, the leach town tunnel is supposed to be filled with Spanish gold bricks. if the tunnel is found who owns the bricks , Spain or Canada. did they test the silver the coins where made from and compare it to the silver from Peru . actually i am not even sure if they even found the lost Spanish mine in south America yet. do we even know that was where the coins where minted?

 

[jeff k]

Re: Odyssey Marine Exploration sinks after judge rules $500 million treasure bel

I'ts funny to read any of you talking about Spain and the Spanish.
I hope that the coins return soon to Spain.

Maximus

Sorry, but the coins will not be going anywhere until the Supreme Court says so, or Spain decides to settle.

 

[maximushisp]

Re: Odyssey Marine Exploration sinks after judge rules $500 million treasure bel

I'ts funny to read any of you talking about Spain and the Spanish.
I hope that the coins return soon to Spain.

Maximus

Sorry, but the coins will not be going anywhere until the Supreme Court says so, or Spain decides to settle.

I know Jeff.