Odd township rules and regulations

[deepskyal]

Was adding to my data base of research since it won't seem to quit raining around here and came across a township that seems to be taking things a bit too far.

Besides the rule in their parks and regulations:
11. Play ball, swim, golf, pitch horseshoes, engage in archery, camp or launch, dock or land any boat, engage in finding buried objects with special detectors, or participate in any other form of recreation, sporting endeavor or pastime, except in those areas which may be designated from time to time for that purpose by the Borough Council.

How about this rediculous rule?:

§401. Prohibited Acts. The throwing, kicking, or knocking of any ball, snowballs, stones or any other missile upon or into any of the public streets, alleys, or sidewalks in the Borough is hereby prohibited. (Ord. 220, 4-7-69; as revised by Ord. 271, 6-8-1992)



§402. Penalties. Any person who shall violate any provision of this Part shall, upon conviction thereof, be sentenced to pay a fine of not more than six hundred dollars ($600.00) and costs, or in default of payment thereof, shall be subject to imprisonment for a term not to exceed thirty (30) days. (Ord. 220, 4-7-69; as revised by Ord. 271, 6-8-1992)

No ball playing in the street...not even a football? A $600.00 fine...dang!!!

Or how about this one on a cerfew:
§602. Purposes. This is a curfew ordinance prescribing, in accordance with prevailing community standards, regulations for the conduct of minors on streets at night, for the protection of younger children in the Borough from each other and from other persons on the streets during nighttime hours, for the enforcement of parental control and responsibility for their children, or the protection of the public from nocturnal mischief by minors and for the reduction of the incident of juvenile criminal activity, all for the good of minors, for the furtherance of family responsibility, and for the public good, safety and welfare. (Ord. 222, 4-7-69; as revised by Ord. 271, 6-8-1992)

Really..."for the enforcement of Parental control"?

I think this borough has taken a few leaps beyond their responsibility in telling parents what their responsibility is.

And I am kind of curious why every violation has a $600.00 fine. Where did they come up with that number?

Could I tell them there is nothing "special" about my metal detector? "Dang officer, this is just a plain old machine, nothing special about it. I thought everyone had one."...lol

Al

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

DR.ÖTEK Metal Detector, Waterproof Gold Detector, Pinpoint & Terrain Modes, Professional Metal Detector - Grab it through Amazon!

[thrillathahunt]

Hey Al, what "town" is this so I can be sure not to go there.

 

[deepskyal]

Hey Al, what "town" is this so I can be sure not to go there.

Everett Borough in Bedford County, Pa.
What's scarier, they seem to share the same type website as a few surrounding boroughs that don't have their rules posted.
What's that saying "Monkey see, monkey do"? Bunch of monkeys making the rules.

Al

 

[bula]

Just another example of some idiot thinking that they are the only ones that can protect others children. Get government out of the family business.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

I'm sure there are cities that have 100 yr. old rules that prohibit spitting on the sidewalk too.

But honestly folks, if you did spit on the sidewalk, in that city, do you think anyone really cares, or would have noticed?? But if you walked into city hall, in that very same city (where no one really cared or would have noticed), and asked: "can I spit on the sidewalk?", they would be obliged to tell you "no", and cite you chapter and verse. So, applying this to our hobby, what does this tell you?

 

[RGINN]

Strange laws about the park, from the info provided. How often are they enforced. The 'no spitting on the sidewalk' law was intended to prevent the spread of tuberculosis. Sidewalk bricks were imprinted with words to the effect of sayin do not spit on the sidewalk. Been a long time since I've seen one, but I'm sure they're still around.

 

[deepskyal]

I'm sure there are cities that have 100 yr. old rules that prohibit spitting on the sidewalk too.

But honestly folks, if you did spit on the sidewalk, in that city, do you think anyone really cares, or would have noticed?? But if you walked into city hall, in that very same city (where no one really cared or would have noticed), and asked: "can I spit on the sidewalk?", they would be obliged to tell you "no", and cite you chapter and verse. So, applying this to our hobby, what does this tell you?

Ordinarily Tom I'd agree with you. But these rules are less than 20 years old, specifically prohibit metal detecting and overstep what I would consider some of our basic privileges.

This is a small town of poor people with nothing better to do than stick their noses in other peoples business.

Just like the knee-jerk response of people seeing us in a park detecting and flipping out that we're destroying things and running to the authorities, I guess the same thing goes for a couple kids tossing a ball and narrowly missing a car or old lady walking down the street. You get one complaint and they pass a law so they have ammo to stick whomever they don't like.

And with a town that is all of 1 square mile...I'm sure the eyes are on you.

I live in a borough that is tiny. They just got the freedom to control their own zoning and changed the name to a village. They spent hundreds of thousands of dollars fixing up a playground that maybe 10 kids play in, rather than focus on blighted property that is driving the whole towns value down.
People watch this million dollar playground like a hawk and they are hell-bent on closing the 2 bars in town and have a neighborhood watch that literally passes out fliers door to door asking you to snitch on your neighbors for any number of things they find offensive.

I agree that there were plenty of asinine rules 100 years ago but small town America is again sinking to some bizarre depths.

Al

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Al, agreed. I guess I meant my rant about the stuff cities find to morph to the question, in cases when there's not a specific prohibition. You know, "damage and destruction" clauses, "no collecting" clauses, "cultural heritage" clauses, etc.... I mean, heck, if we all looked long enough and hard enough, I bet there's really no place you can detect (barring perhaps some beaches). But oddly, if you just be a little discreet, and don't be seen "in process" of extraction while busy-bodies are present staring, then most of the time, no one cares.

Yes, some of the odd rules we read about might have come from someone rushing to city hall with a complaint. So they end up implementing the oddest micro-rules like this (rather than dealing with things on a case-by-case basis for *just* the one person who left open craters).

 

[BARGuy]

Wellll, could it be that somewhere along the line somebody brought a lawsuit against a borough because of some nitsh** occurence? And as stated earlier, this is a knee-jerk reaction?

If you break down most local ordinances, including HOAs, POAs, etc., you'll find that the bottom line is "liability".

With all the new attorneys we get every year, they have to keep drumming up additional revenue. Never shoulda let 'em advertise on TV!

Adios, DR

 

[deepskyal]

Quite possibly BARGuy...lol

Funny thing...my girlfriend and I were commenting on the number of cars that have been running into buildings lately. Seems every couple days for the last couple months.

I made the joke that pretty soon they'll blame the home or building owners for not having a "No Drive thru Window" sign posted....lol

Al

 

[watercolor]

Wow

Hey Al, what "town" is this so I can be sure not to go there.

Everett Borough in Bedford County, Pa.
What's scarier, they seem to share the same type website as a few surrounding boroughs that don't have their rules posted.
What's that saying "Monkey see, monkey do"? Bunch of monkeys making the rules.
Al

A few years ago I was researching the ordinances of some of the smaller towns near where I live and found many
of them had identical "boiler-plate" regulations. . . including the prohibition of metal detecting. I also discovered that
the wording for these ordinances were picked up, word-for-word, from a website that specialized in writing "politically correct"
ordinances for "smaller" villages & towns.

(Political Correctness: A doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority aimed at taping the mouth of anyone
who might dare oppose their own self-serving causes)

 

[Tom_in_CA]

water-color, excellent point. It's true: a lot of cities, when it comes time to wording their own ordinances, charters, rules, laws, regulations, etc.... simply borrow from other's already existing wording (to the point of word for word). Why? Because it beats the heck out of getting lawyers hired to put it all in legaleese when someone else in your state or nearby "has already done all the homework for you".

But what makes that interesting, for us (in this hobby), is that when you've gone 50 pages into such minutia, and see something that may in fact address metal detecting, you have to wonder if the rank and file beat cop or gardener really knows or cares about such minutia? Or was it something that was just buried into wording from the easy-to-copy charter from somewhere, that no one ever really reads that deeply into?

I bet in a lot of these cases (where they've simply borrowed from someone else's pre-existing wording), that it would only be applied in the case of a complaint. Much like a noise ordinance: there is decibal limits, but no one brings out the decibal meter unless there is a complaint. Right? I know this example because I run a street sweeper business, where we make noise at night. We simply run our trucks in industrial neighborhoods at times when residentials would generate complaints. Did that mean the noise curfew didnt' exist in the industrial district? No. Of course not. It's still in the city limits. But when there's no one to complain or notice, we skate along, when technically, if I brought my own decibal meter out, I'm probably in violation. I think this is the case for a lot of places where you *might* find specific wording for md'ing too. JMHO

 

[ivan salis]

point blank --its about piss poor "money hungery" rural towns that typically are too poor to hire lawyers to write a proper set of laws for their township --so they just go to a litle town laws "website" and lift the whole package of "just say no" laws --then if anyone so much as farts ,well fine the snot out of em ($600 bucks is most likely the largest fine legally allowible for a township to impose) , its a sad mix of power mad , money hungry lil local "nobody" political folks trying to both squeeze money from folks anyway they can and to micro manage and "control" their local population to a degree that would make both adolf hilter and boss hogg weep with joy *

these types of places are often "speed trap" towns as well --feasting upon any poor soul who makes the mistake of doing 1 mile per hour over their "strictly enforced" speed limits *---we got a couple of em--evil little spots like that just down the road on highway 301 * waldo & starke florida * --extremely rural -- most of the folks that live there work in the state pen near there. - P.S. -the towns "fund" most of their public expenditures off of "speeding tickets"--given out to tourist and other folks passing thru --local folks know all about em.

* both waldo and starke , have several tourist type "spots" for folks to stop at * however unless you are going slowly thru the small towns your most likely not going to stop at em-- so via their "speed traps" they make very sure you go slow in hopes you WILL stop and spend money in their town -- one way or another. --they think of highway 301 that runs thru town as a-- fast car "toll booth" -- at the very least you WILL see what they town has to offer "tourist" as you very slowly drive thru it . --waldo has a HUGE FLEA MARKET / ANTIQUE MARKET BY THE WAY

 

[truckinbutch]

Ivan :
Know xactly what youre sayin . Watched that bunch of "Barney"'s nail a lot of folks over the years . Only money that came out of my pocket there was for produce at the flea market .
Jim

 

[wildman4910]

"Monkey see, monkey do"? Bunch of monkeys making the rules.

Al

Yup, just like a bunch of monkeys tossin darts at a board. Ya hit the nail on the head Al.

The wording for these ordinances were picked up, word-for-word, from a website that specialized in writing "politically correct"
ordinances for "smaller" villages & towns.

(Political Correctness: A doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority aimed at taping the mouth of anyone
who might dare oppose their own self-serving causes)

"Political Correctness" is nothing more than "Polite Tyranny", and should be ruthlessly exterminated whenever it is found.
It's like Kudzu, no matter how much weed killer you spray on it it just keeps poppin up.

~~Happy Hunting~~​

 

[deepskyal]

Yea, I can see the obvious repetitiveness of the websites from borough to borough in that county.

You may well have a valid point there Tom. If they just duplicated the laws from another site, nobody would give 2 hoots about detecting.

When I think about it, in a town of 1 square mile, how many complaints on detecting could there really be? And to the local police, would they really be so concerned about a guy harmlessly swinging a machine to poke out a few coins? As a matter of fact, in such a small town...do they even HAVE a police force? Will someone call the state boys over something so trivial? Like the boy calling wolf!

In this age of technology, "borrowing" someone else's regulations would be as easy as checking out the county website and duplicating what they see.

Of course, being technologically handicapped as I am, I didn't know they had a web site listing their rules.

Al