Newbie needs help identifying sword (Solved)

[Native Virginian]

I have been lurking on T-net for several years and have been impressed with the abilities of the T-net folks in identifying items. That said I have a sword that has been in the family forever and I inherited it when my mother passed away several years ago.I just relocated it stuck in the back corner of a closet. I remember playing with this sword when I was a small child in the mid-50's. The family story is that it was my G.G. grandfathers during the civil war, he fought for the south and it is documented that he was at least a Captain and possibly a Major towards the end of the war. the sword does not look like a family heirloom, but rather a dug relic. The sword has a very uniform brown patina.
I have been researching this sword and I believe this sword was made by Nathan Starr. As you can see from the pictures the grip tang is angled down from the centerline of the blade, which was a Nathan Starr trademark.The pommel is identical to the 1818 Nathan Starr Contract Calvary Saber. the upper guard is also identical to the 1818 model but that's where the similarities end. The rest of the guard is a basket type while typical Starr swords have a stirrup type guard.This sword also has two fullers on both sides of the blade and I have not been able to identify any Starr swords with two fullers. Length f the blade from the guard to the tip around the curve of the blade is 40'' and from the tip to the pommel is 45''. the blade is 1 1/4'' wide and 3/16'' thick. There are no visible markings even under magnification and a chalk rub.
Anyone have any ideas? Could this possibly be a custom Starr sword or is it a confederate copy of a Starr sword. While this sword will never be sold I would like to know it's history and value to pass onto my kids.

Thank you for looking NV

 

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[SkyPirate]

Re: Newbie needs help identifying sword

We need some more pictures, a full shot and some closeups.

 

[Native Virginian]

Re: Newbie needs help identifying sword

Skypilot I have about 12 more picures to down load but it won't let me do multiple attachments. all of the files are about 70 kb??

 

[Native Virginian]

Re: Newbie needs help identifying sword

More pictures

 

[Native Virginian]

Re: Newbie needs help identifying sword

And more

 

[IronSpike]

Re: Newbie needs help identifying sword

Welcome to Tnet Native Virginian

I don't know much about swords, however can see the similarities to the Nathan Star contract cavalry saber. Still looks a little different though

That's a neat piece

http://arms2armor.com/Swords/1818cav.htm

 

[Native Virginian]

Re: Newbie needs help identifying sword

SkyPirate; I apologize for calling you Skypilot in my 2nd post, I was rushing trying to figure out why I could only do 1 attachment per post, turned out it was in my antivirus and can still only post 4 attachments. Again I apologize for the mis-ID.

Iron Spike; thanks for the welcome! Yes the sword looks like the Starr 1818 contract saber there are many differences. The length of my sword does not match anything Starr is recorded making under contract to the Government.

Spooky; you're right that guard matches nothing I could find. it's more than a stirrup type guard but not quite a true basket type.

That's what has been so frustrating about trying to ID a manufacturer and era for this sword.

Thanks for the replies,

Happy Hunting!

NV

 

[IronSpike]

Re: Newbie needs help identifying sword

Any markings at all on the saber?

The hilt/guard on this one a better match:

http://www.historicalimagebank.com/...ified+Virginia+Manufactory+Cavalry+Saber.html

I think I found a match:

http://images.google.com/imgres?img...ges?q=virginia+modified+saber&hl=en&sa=N&um=1

 

[taz42o]

Re: Newbie needs help identifying sword

Nice ID Ironspike , I looked a long time and could'nt find it.

Virginian, That's a nice saber with good family history I would look into professional restoration in your area. If not , here is a link but they are in Ca. but you can buy grips , wire and scabbards all of witch I think you could do yourself without hurting the value.

http://www.cds1.net/~nardi/swords/index.htm

 

[Native Virginian]

Iron Spike has it. Great ID! I appreciate everyones effort! Now that I know the era of the sword it starts me wondering how my family obtained it? They were and are now waterman and farmer. kind of makes you wonder if it turned up under a plough or in a oyster dredge.

Any way Great ID Iron Spike, you did in a couple of hours something I have been trying to do for over a year.

Taz; thanks for the link! I may check into a professional restoration. I think I want it to come out of the closet and become a wall hanger.

Happy Hunting Everyone
NV

 

[IronSpike]

Would be interesting to hear whether restoration is recommended and to what extend. Hey it's a beaut 'as is' and definitely a wall hanger Would be a find of a lifetime for most detectorists. It's now on my to find list

NV have you detected any on the family farm?

Virginia was the keyword in the search. Spooky Rando had the date range

 

[Native Virginian]

Iron Spike unfortunately my G G grandfather was the last true farmer in the clan and over the years the 200 plus acres were sold off to various adjacent farms until there was only the house and out buildings on a couple of acres left. In the early 1950's the house was shut down due to the health of my G Grandparents. My Grandmother maintained the property until 1970 when she sold it. I remember as a child going up to check on the property and being fascinated with all of the "old" stuff in the house. I distinctly remember a hand cranked Victrola record player and player piano in the house. The house was sold when I was 16 and at that point in my life I could not have cared less for "all that old junk" in the house. I regret that now but such is life.

I have been lurking on T-net for a long time and history and relic hunting have always fascinated me since I have gotten older. My wife has told me many times to go out and buy a detector if i wanted one but I already maintain two other expensive hobbies and would never do it. She surprised me at Christmas with a detector and I am still learning to use it in my own yard. When I have mastered it I plan on detecting in the general area of the old property as I still have cousins owning property there and a guy I work with owns about 15 acres in the vicinity.The entire area is rich in history.

As a side note; I have been researching the Virginia Arms Manufactory which has a fascinating history and will post a condensed version later today.

Thanks again to everyone.
NV