Need some verifications on some CW finds PLEASE

[ModernMiner]

I have a few items that I wanted to run by some of you CW experts that I haven't ID'd yet. All three were found at CW areas.

1) The first item I dug up at the 1830's CW house last Saturday and thought it was junk until I was checking out a few CW relic sites and found one that I thing may be the same. Mine is in WAY better condition though.
The relic site I found has it listed as a "Nose cap for a U.S. Springfield rifle". My piece is pictures #1 & #2.
The one they have is picture #3.
Are they a match?

2) I dug this item (picture #4) up today at the farm I've been hunting for a year now, and have found numerous CW items. If I remember correctly, I think I saw this piece was a part of an umbrella? Did CW soldier have umbrellas?

3) This oval piece I dug up on a farm a while back between the Bentonville battlefield and Raleigh.
After searching some relic sites, I see some oval pieces that look a lot like mine listed as a "Saddle Shield".
Mine is picture #5.
Pictures #6 & #7 were from CW relic web sites. Mine looks VERY close to picture #6 I think.
What do you think? A match?

I would love to add these pieces to my CW relic display, but want to be sure first.
Thanks for your help,
MM

 

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[srss]

They all look like a match to me and before i read your post i posted the same thing about the umbrella looking piece. Lol.

 

[Angelo]

They all look like a match to me and before i read your post i posted the same thing about the umbrella looking piece. Lol.

That crap happens a lot around here and it's scary.

Sometimes 2 or 3 people find the same type of objects in different states and about the same time.

Tony

 

[Montana Jim]

MM... the umbrella piece... I'm fairly sure that's what you have... of course - it coulda' been from a parasol too...

It's either the "top notch" or the "runner" part.

However - I have heard others disagree. Bottom line, every time I've seen one on-line it's been identified as an umbrella part.

Maybe a trip to find an antique or era umbrella would settle the question.

 

[trusty]

That looks like a nose cap. Is there a groove on what would be the bottom? That would be for a ramrod. If you can find a picture (I couldn't) of a CVA Kentucky, you'll find one very similar. I only have "hawken" style & the ramrod goes through these nose caps.

 

[ModernMiner]

That looks like a nose cap. Is there a groove on what would be the bottom? That would be for a ramrod. If you can find a picture (I couldn't) of a CVA Kentucky, you'll find one very similar. I only have "hawken" style & the ramrod goes through these nose caps.

Trusty,
I had e-mailed the guy with the CW relic site to see if his also has the two pins on the bottom like mine. I just received a reply from him and his DOES have the two pins too. Looks like mine is a nose cap. Ya-hoo.
I had to dig it out of the garbage when I got home from work today, because I threw it away on Saturday thinking it was junk.
-MM-

 

[srss]

Hey MM better start keeping everything. Theres no tellin what i have threw away.

 

[ModernMiner]

Hey MM better start keeping everything. Theres no tellin what i have threw away.

You would think I would have learned my lesson by now. I threw a CW belt keeper away some months ago.
I'm learning a lot about CW relics by looking at the pictures on some of the CW relic web sites.
-MM-

 

[ModernMiner]

I went to a Military gun & relic show today at our state fairgrounds. It was a bit disappointing to me as there were tons of vendors and guns, but only a handful of CW relic booths. Maybe five at best. I had a few guys wanting to buy some of my relics, but I'm not interested in selling anything. At least not right now.
To follow up on this post and the round piece above with all the notches, I had two different replies today on that piece.
The first guy seemed very know legable and had confirmed that it was indeed part of an umbrella.
The second guy, who I didn't much care for after he rummaged through the relics I had nice and neat in my display case and scattered them all over the place, said it was NOT part of an umbrella. He said that an umbrella piece would have ELEVEN notches in it, and this piece was probably a nut off of a tractor.
What do you CW relic folks think?
-MM-

 

[ivan salis]

a nut would be threaded--- I see no threading (a bushing however would not) -- so you know who the nut is -- in my veiw its the spreader part that when you push it upwards up the the wooden or metal shaft --spreads open the tines outward thus opening the umbrella -- it would have a even number rather than a odd number most likey to balance out the stress evenly on the cloth covering -- look at a modern one . --- Ivan

 

[ModernMiner]

a nut would be threaded--- I see no threading (a bushing however would not) -- so you know who the nut is -- in my veiw its the spreader part that when you push it upwards up the the wooden or metal shaft --spreads open the tines outward thus opening the umbrella -- it would have a even number rather than a odd number most likey to balance out the stress evenly on the cloth covering -- look at a modern one . --- Ivan

I agree Ivan. I think the guy was the nut.
I saw one of these on a relic site and it still had a metal tube part attached to it that rides up the shaft. Plus, eleven rods sounds like an awful lot of rods for an umbrella.
Thanks,
MM

 

[Montana Jim]

He said that an umbrella piece would have ELEVEN notches in it, and this piece was probably a nut off of a tractor.

What do you CW relic folks think?

I don't think there was a law or anything... 9, 10, 11...

And there were lottsa manufacturers... I guess the key is the size of the inner diameter of the ring and how it was attached.

 

[Montana Jim]

 

[ivan salis]

while there was no law --think logically design wise --- if you have a uneven number the stress on the unit would be uneven and not equally spread out -- that would cause it to pop inside out very easily in a strong wind ( not a good thing)--- however a even number of tines say 8 to 12 -- would spread the wind stress more evenly--(count the tines )---- theres 10 in the above picture --ones behind the post hiding ) thus making it less likely to do that . make sense? Ivan

 

[Montana Jim]

 

[ivan salis]

while there is more tines in number (16) it still a even number of tines -- for equal wind stress spread -- the one "relic" guy guy said 11 tines which I think quite odd (just because you rent a booth and hang a "relic dealer" sign on it -- that does not make you a "relic expert") -- 11 to me is a a very odd number -- 10 or 12 yah I would say ok --but 11 ? --nah -- look even the one jim showed had 10 tines -- a even number of tines was and is the design norm for that type of product is the point I 'm trying to make -- mainly due to the logical design and use of the item. --- Ivan

 

[Montana Jim]

Ivan - I have to show pictures because I'm not quite the eloquent speaker you are

Thanks for the back up

 

[ivan salis]

jim whats the saying a picture is worth 1000 words? by using larger and stronger tines fewer were needed --- the finer the tines the more was needed since they were not as strong --- see the differance between the heavy "beach style" in the first photo and the dainty type in the second photo-- yours seemed a like a 8 tine heavy duty type --similar in design to the 10 tine "beach style" type above. -- Ivan