Need an Eagle Button explaination

[Breezie]

Since the snow & cold weather has shut down my MD-ing, I decided to drag out the ole button box. Could someone explain to me why both of these buttons look identical on the front, yet one is Civil War and the other is 1890s? According to my McGuinn book, Superior Quality was a Civil War era button and Waterbury Button Co. * * * (3 stars) is circa 1890.

Like BigCypressHunter, I bought a box of buttons and figured they were all modern until today. I'll be posting some others later. At least it will give us something to think about since the ground is as hard as a brick bat, and it's cold as a witch's well digger! Breezie

 

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[BioProfessor]

This is about the best I can do. The front of a military button is determined by the branch of service that uses the button. They decide if and when to change the design that represents the branch. The back of the button is marked by the manufacturer of the button. The manufacturer is determined by who was awarded the contract to produce the buttons. The manufacturer determines what the backmark will be, when it will be changed, and what it will be changed to.

So for this button, the manufacturer during the civil war used "Superior Quality" as their backmark and the manufacturer of the buttons used, most likely, for reunions during the 1890's was Waterbury and this is the backmark they used during this time period.

Does that come close to answering the question?

Daryl

 

[Breezie]

Daryl,
YES, and you explained it exactly; thank you! The problem I was having is seeing 6 or 8 buttons that look identical on the front, yet some span 40 years or more in age. As I determine the 'age' of my buttons, there is no need to even look at the front. After dating them, I can then determine the 'branch' of service by the front.

Was Superior Quality a company name or was that a backmark used by Waterbury? Thanks again, Breezie

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Was Superior Quality a company name or was that a backmark used by Waterbury? Thanks again, Breezie

The Superior Quality backmark was used into the 1900's and I think its generic.. How do I know? I have Great Seal buttons (post 1902)with this backmark.

I believe this eagle front is still used today by the US Navy but Im not positive. I know it was used at least into WWII. I believe you have 2- 20th century buttons. You may want to research when the head was turned. MJ may know the answer.

 

[Breezie]

BCH, thanks for your post. I find dating buttons confusing. If Superior Quality is listed in McG's book under the heading of Civil War Period Backmarks, then why was there not some type of change to the backmark when it was used at a later time? Sooooooo, just because the backmark is Superior Quality does not mean it is CW period as shown in McGuinn's book. I think you've done a fantastic job on your Great Seal button list. I'm sure I'll come across some of those in my button box. Is there a book published that has globs of pics of both the front and the back of 'post' CW buttons? Breezie

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

BCH, thanks for your post. I find dating buttons confusing. If Superior Quality is listed in McG's book under the heading of Civil War Period Backmarks, then why was there not some type of change to the backmark when it was used at a later time? Sooooooo, just because the backmark is Superior Quality does not mean it is CW period as shown in McGuinn's book. I think you've done a fantastic job on your Great Seal button list. I'm sure I'll come across some of those in my button box. Is there a book published that has globs of pics of both the front and the back of 'post' CW buttons? Breezie

I think Superior Quality is a generic backmark. If they said it was used during the CW period, it probably was. It was also used later. Maybe there are slight differences. A button needs to be IDed by both sides. I have WWI Great Seal buttons with CW era backmarks because the old molds and old button stocks were still used at a later period...

I would say ID the front first to find out what branch and era it was used, then look at the backmark for the manufacturer and any other clue.

In this case, you have a generic backmark so you need to find out when the US Navy used eagle facing left. The Waterbury button backmark I dont have with 3 stars. It may be 1890. Cool. Maybe I could add it to my list.
I need get ready for work. I stay in the Everglades every Tues Wed and Thurs.

 

[ivan salis]

in the olden days --terms like superior quailty * were used to "puff" up your button over other buttons -- since buttons tended to looked alike --you tried to make yours "stand out " vs competitors buttons -- using "puff" terms was a common way to do it -- various puff terms were common used on british made buttons from thre early 1800 - 1820 era (superior qualty -- double gilt , treble gilt , orange coluor , ect) == because of the serious shortage of buttons due to the war of 1812 (the british made most buttons used in the us at the time) the waterbury button company was set up to make "american made" buttons -- over the years fronts often stayed the same for certain designs --but the back marks would change due to differant makers --contracts or fads of the day . --- often its the back marks that are the key to finding the correct time frame and maker of the buttons.

 

[jgas]

Possibly on another note: Would it be said that the tops of the wings play a part in when these were made as well. Look at both and let me know if I am seeing things. The tops of the wings from one to the other are uneven. I believe I read an earlier post that would suggest that the tops of the wings, if not even, would suggest CW era or vice versa. Let me know, just a thought. jgas

 

[Breezie]

Possibly on another note: Would it be said that the tops of the wings play a part in when these were made as well. Look at both and let me know if I am seeing things. The tops of the wings from one to the other are uneven. I believe I read an earlier post that would suggest that the tops of the wings, if not even, would suggest CW era or vice versa. Let me know, just a thought. jgas

jgas; you're right! Good eye I checked out the wings and they are slightly different.

Ivan,BCH, thanks for the adding to Daryl's info. Button id-ing is complicated as well as confusing. My hats to ya! Breezie

 

[CRUSADER]

Daryl,
YES, and you explained it exactly; thank you! The problem I was having is seeing 6 or 8 buttons that look identical on the front, yet some span 40 years or more in age. As I determine the 'age' of my buttons, there is no need to even look at the front. After dating them, I can then determine the 'branch' of service by the front.

Was Superior Quality a company name or was that a backmark used by Waterbury? Thanks again, Breezie

In answer to the above, the 'Superior Quality' backmark is a 'Quality mark' like 'Triple Gilt' & nothing to do with a company name.

 

[vayank54]

Possibly on another note: Would it be said that the tops of the wings play a part in when these were made as well. Look at both and let me know if I am seeing things. The tops of the wings from one to the other are uneven. I believe I read an earlier post that would suggest that the tops of the wings, if not even, would suggest CW era or vice versa. Let me know, just a thought. jgas

jgas; you're right! Good eye I checked out the wings and they are slightly different.

Ivan,BCH, thanks for the adding to Daryl's info. Button id-ing is complicated as well as confusing. My hats to ya! Breezie

Both buttons are pst civil war. The backmarks in the book are close to the ones on the button but not the same. Both buttons are after 1941 as that is when the eagles on navy buttons with horizontal anchors were turned to our left. On earlier navies the eagle will be facing our right. Yes Iding buttons can be complicated. I've been doing it for 40 years and still have to go back to the books sometimes. On buttons with impressed Waterbury backmarks. As a rule of thumb civil war period buttons will have WATERBURY BUTTON CO EXTRA. IF they have have the word extra and a rope looking circle around the shank they could be civil war but are more than likely a bit later. Most Warerbury buttons with impressed marks and without the word extra are post civil war. The only ones I can think of without extra are some cuff that have WATERBURY BUTTON CO with one star. Waterbury buttons with 3 stars are always post civil war. I hope this helps.