Mexico will recover a lost galleon in 1631 in Campeche

[Vox veritas]

http://translate.google.com/transla...f=1&u=http://impreso.milenio.com/node/9131960

 

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[VOC]

I like that one:

We archaeologist will go after the Treasure Ships to stop the poachers going after them!

Parasites, they are only interested in most wrecks when there is Treasure aboard.

There is far more historically important shipwrecks that they should be looking at, but “No” they (like the Spanish) only want to get their hands on the Shinny stuff.

And to think they want us all in the private sector to pay for their Treasure Hunting activities through our taxes.

Dreadful People

 

[Alexandre]

I like that one:

We archaeologist will go after the Treasure Ships to stop the poachers going after them!

Parasites, they are only interested in most wrecks when there is Treasure aboard.

VOC, you have to make up your mind: either we are a bunch of parasites because we will be excavating a treasure ship or we are a bunch of lazy, ivory tower dwellers, because we have never found and excavated a treasure ship... you really cant have both..

 

[bigscoop]

From a purely archeological standpoint, and tossing aside all the obvious monetary gains, I can't imagine what kind of fantastic discovery could possibly be found on yet another galleon wreck that is so vastly different from the others to be worth all the expense? I mean, from start to finish what's an archeological project like this cost, plus the continued preservation process? Seems to me if this has nothing to do with monetary gains then this is a very bad business plan for those who are funding it. On the other hand, form a mutal partnership, split the cost, split the gains, and give the "people" funding these projects a well-deserved break.

 

[Alexandre]

From a purely archeological standpoint, and tossing aside all the obvious monetary gains, I can't imagine what kind of fantastic discovery could possibly be found on yet another galleon wreck that is so vastly different from the others to be worth all the expense?

Well, maybe it's because no treasure ships has ever been excavated by archaeologists....

 

[Mackaydon]

The target, of course, is the NS de Juncal.

 

[VOC]

"VOC, you have to make up your mind: either we are a bunch of parasites because we will be excavating a treasure ship or we are a bunch of lazy, ivory tower dwellers, because we have never found and excavated a treasure ship... you really cant have both.. "

Alexandre, I dont think your clan is Lazy, I just think you should all concentrate on the hundreds of really historically important wrecks that need recording before they are lost forever, whilst leaving the less important and well-known treasure wrecks to the well funded private sector.

Would Spain have put the same effort into the legal fight to get back some ships timbers or cannon balls ?

The answer is "No" because it is not Treasure.

Would the JNAPC be jumping up and down if Odyssey were going to work on and record a old none treasure carrying merchant ship in deep water ?. (No they would be bighting their hand off as a way forward for recording deep water sites).

I have yet to work with a archaeologist who does not get excited by gold and feature it prominently in any presentation they give.

The problem is Socialist don’t like the word profit, so we will never close the gap.

 

[bigscoop]

So where does my ignorance rest in not understanding why archeologist and salvers can't work under a mutual satisfying plan? What is wrong with letting the really rare and historically significant finds going to the state and the remainder going to the private possession of the salvers who have not only earned it, but provided most of it?

 

[VOC]

Treasure Hunters will work with Archaeologist, but most Archaeologist are too arrogant to work with the Treasure Hunters.

 

[bigscoop]

Treasure Hunters will work with Archeaologist, but most Archeaologist are too arrogant to work with the Treasure Hunters.

But, and being respectful and understanding of your personal feelings, that's not really an answer. It's just more stone throwing into the already roaring river of stones. From the outside looking in I see what could be an absolutely FANTASTIC partnership, and yet, apparently it is everything but that. Why? What are the real "inside" issues that prevent it?

 

[VOC]

Bigscoop

Unfortunately it is only a one sided problem mainly based on job preservation and or envy.

None of their other issues stand up to scrutiny or logic.

 

[piratediver]

About 10 years ago i had Dr. Gene Lyon speak to my class about the Spanish treasure fleets. After finishing his talk the Mexican naval officer said that some of his colleagues had searched for JUNCAL but did not find it. Lyon told him in a very diplomatic way that is because they were looking in the wrong place. Lyon and Jack Haskins had a fantastic body of data on JUNCAL among many others including MERCEDES and SAN JOSE 1708.


Pirate Diver

 

[Mackaydon]

I believe the title to this thread his misleading "Mexico will RECOVER a lost galleon..." In fact, the cited reference only states Mexico will begin the SEARCH FOR, not recover, the lost galleon.
Don.....

 

[tarpon192]

well, maybe it's because no treasure ships has ever been excavated by archaeologists....

whatever!

 

[AUVnav]

I could be a good relationship, but currently, the technology is not there yet, in many ways. As we have seen with examples such as the Vasa and Mary Rose, the incredible expense of stabilization and restoration shows that recovery and restoration just isnt viable yet.
That leaves the team to leave the significant ideology and foundation of archaeology, the layering of a site and the association of artefacts, at odds with the treasure hunting methods and goals.
If a site team could be put into place, that was properly funded from the beginning, without the need to sell off the artefacts to make book, then there is a distinct possibility that a workable plan could be made to, at least partially, document and recover a site.
Following Alexandre, any examples of this would be interesting to review.

Will add this story... http://news.yahoo.com/photos/exlusi...JlbmRpbmdub3cEcHQDc3RvcnlwYWdlBHRlc3QD;_ylv=3

 

[mariner]

Speaking personally, I am as interested, indeed more so, in a historic wreck being examined and salvaged by State archaeologists as I am in wrecks being privately salvaged. It's the history and the knowledge that is important to me. I am all in favour of private salvage, provided the details are properly recorded and reported, but I hope that this will definitely be the case when wrecks are being examined and recovered by a country, such as Mexico in this case.

Mariner

 

[VOC]

The only problem with States doing underwater archaeology is that they are normally constrained by time and budget and often do not have the ability to raise further funds to complete the job.

The other problem many state paid underwater archaeologist lack any real passion for the subject and are often always looking for the new project to get involved with rather than compleating the one they are on.

Like Mariner says it’s all about the knowledge and it does not matter who obtains it as long as it is recorded for posterity.

 

[mariner]

I mean, of course, if they ever find it!

Mariner