Lead Object With Writing, No Idea What It Is.

[Digger62918]

Went out detecting with a buddy today at a site that dates back to the mid 1800's. He found this cool relic but we have no idea what it is. Is is made of lead and has a large letter M With a line and 39 below it. Does anyone have ANY information on this object? Your help and thoughts are greatly appreciated!

 

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[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Lead Object With Stamp, Need Some Info!

is it a lead seal?

 

[vayank54]

yep a lead seal.

 

[Digger62918]

If this is a lead seal what do the numbers represent? The Year?

 

[vayank54]

to be honest on that one I have no idea. I've seen ones similar to yours used by electric companies years ago. They used them on the electric meters on the sides of houses up into the 1960's or 70's. I'm sure the ones like you found had other uses as well.
They had a wire that looped around and was crimped into the seal. To open whatever the seal was securing the wire had to be cut.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Without seeing the back, it looks like rust remains from the wire. The numbers could mean anything.

 

[Silver Searcher]

Could also be a Lead Bale Seal

SS

 

[IronSpike]

Looks like an A after 39.

 

[bradyboy]

the numbers look like the are embossed, not debossed
in other words, they look like raised numbers ?
can we see a side view and the other side?
Brady

 

[tabdog]

That is a bale seal.

They only look like the meter seals.

They stopped using bale seals in the
mid 1800's. That was before gas and
elec.

Here is one I found,

They identified trade goods in transit.

Happy Huntin,

Tabdog

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

That is a bale seal.

They only look like the meter seals.

They stopped using bale seals in the
mid 1800's. That was before gas and
elec.

Here is one I found,

They identified trade goods in transit.

Happy Huntin,

Tabdog

Hard to tell without a picture of the back. They were used for railroads as well as utilities.
It looks like yours has metal in it. Notice the date July 14, 1857 is the same patent date as the old seal..

http://www.railroadiana.org/hw/pgSealers.php
http://tinyurl.com/2b936hw



You can search cloth seals if you wish. http://ourpasthistory.com/Gallery/bagseals?page=1
http://www.colchestertreasurehunting.co.uk/baleseals.htm

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Tabdog, heres your original Meers & Houlton 1857 patent. Its one of the early lead railroad seals with the July 14 patent date. Nice find. Looks like it say Little Rock?

http://tinyurl.com/2bx93ad http://tinyurl.com/2bx93ad

.

Wow its a lotta work trying to post all this lol.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

The 1857 patent says for the baggage patent seal: Seal for Railroad Freight Cars. ...device for sealing freight cars, express chests, custom packages, wine cellars, mail bags, hatches of vessels, & etc.


Diggers looks like a utility seal because I see rust, but we need a pic of the back and side to be sure. It does kinda look like a cloth seal.

 

[Felinepeachy]

I have a lead seal from a beer company

 

[tabdog]

I have a lead seal from a beer company

It would appear that "bale seal" is a European term.

Bale seals have the same definition, but go back a
lot longer in time.

Some people think bale seals are for cloth or cotton,
or something like that.

But they have the same use as the RR seals.

I stand corrected.

But, the patina on the seals assure that they were
around before gas, electricity or butane.

Happy Huntin,

Tabdog

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

It would appear that "bale seal" is a European term.

Bale seals have the same definition, but go back a
lot longer in time.

Some people think bale seals are for cloth or cotton,
or something like that.

But they have the same use as the RR seals.

I stand corrected.

But, the patina on the seals assure that they were
around before gas, electricity or butane.

Happy Huntin,

Tabdog

All I know is one type has metal wire and the other type does not. It appears his and yours both have metal wire. (post 1857) The cloth and bag early types (pre 1857ish) do not appear to have wire. Im assuming a bag is a bale. http://ourpasthistory.com/Gallery/bagseals?page=1


Did you notice I found the meaning of your Little Rock seal date? Because yours is patent dated, it would be before electric. Yours is about 1857-1870. Im not so sure about his.

 

[tabdog]

Bale seals such were single disc seals, rather than two disc seals, and were
also used to identify textiles, as well as parcels and bales of trade goods.

That comes from the bale seal site,

http://www.colchestertreasurehunting.co.uk/baleseals.htm

The use is the same.

But, you are probably right about the steel wire.

They just never called them bale seals here.

Some folks do.

They could be wrong as well.

Happy Huntin,

Tabdog

 

[tabdog]

A funny thing about bale seals.

For hundreds of years, the Europeans used bale seals.
They made tens of thousands of kinds. Some even had
string or wire in them.

An American comes along in the 1800's and invents the
bale seal. But, he does not call it a bale seal,,,,

Of course not. He's gettin a patent. He don't want to
look like a copy cat!!!!

So now,,,,, is a bale seal really not a bale seal

Or does it just depend on which country you happen
to be in?

Hay guys, I didn't invent the idea or the controversy.

This same subject has cropped up with varying out
comes on other forums.......... The out come of the
discussions seems to depend on tha players.

Happy Huntin,

Tabdog

 

[tabdog]

Did you notice I found the meaning of your Little Rock seal date? Because yours is patent dated, it would be before electric. Yours is about 1857-1870. Im not so sure about his.

Hay bigcypresshunter,

Yes I did.

It was from a Company in Little Rock.
I was never able to tell what kind of
goods it was for. It could just have
been for security purposes.

Happy Huntin,

Tabdog

 

[tabdog]

Did you notice I found the meaning of your Little Rock seal date? Because yours is patent dated, it would be before electric. Yours is about 1857-1870. Im not so sure about his.

Hay bigcypresshunter,

Yes I did.

It was from a Company in Little Rock.
I was never able to tell what kind of
goods it was for. It could just have
been for security purposes.

I am not trying to say I am right. I
don't know.

I just used a commonly used term
and got called on it.

Any brighter minds are welcomed, by
me, to chime in.

Happy Huntin,

Tabdog