Knife needs help

[oldbattleaxe]

Good morning forum. I am considering buying this knife. The price is high and cannot take a chance without some expertise> the seller says he thinks it was made in the 1840-50's and used in the Confederacy. To me it looks like having the same type blade used in the Mexican War and with the brass eagle all in one piece with the grip and cross guard. The grips are brass pinned and on the pommel end it is hammered just like the American D Guard. Is it possible that it could have been used in the gold mine's of the 49er's. No makers name. Length 17 1/2" x 1 1/2" width. You opinions are welcome. Bill

 

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[gunsil]

Stay away!! Go to Bernard Levine - Knife Expertise: Knife ID, Knife Laws, Knife Values and ask Bernard Levine about this knife. He is America's leading expert on old knives (you can google his credentials). He charges a small fee that is well worth it if you avoid getting burned. If you look at all the purported "civil war" or "used in the civil war" knives it would seem that by the survival rate that every soldier must have carried three or four knives. In fact most didn't carry one at all. The knife in your photo looks like a Mexican late 1800s-early 1900s military knife with a re-shaped blade. But do ask Mr. Levine, he will tell you a lot about it, and the education will be well worth his small fee. ALWAYS buy the knife, not the story!!

 

[Red James Cash]

I'll add a little to gunsils post.Take a look at the wood grips.Wood tends to shrink with age.The grips on the knife look pretty flush with the metal of the handle.I have a knife made in 1923.The ebony grips have some shrinkage to them,not much but enough to tell.

 

[pippinwhitepaws]

I agree with gunsil...
the knife is beautiful...
but so many dishonest people out there...knives are a premium for forgers with skill.

 

[oldbattleaxe]

In hands the grips and all of the rest of the knife is old. No question? If by chance the blade has been cut down it would have been shaped in the 18th century. Too much wear and dark rust only from age. Our guess is that it is at least pre Civil War, correct? Most of the Mexican American War blades seem to have thin blades. This one is 1/4" thick, typical of American knives 1840's. When we say a knife was made for the Mexican American War does that mean it only was used in that war? I will try and get some close up pics.

 

[oldbattleaxe]

In hands the grips and all of the rest of the knife is old. No question? If by chance the blade has been cut down it would have been shaped in the 18th century. Too much wear and dark rust only from age. Our guess is that it is at least pre Civil War, correct? Most of the Mexican American War blades seem to have thin blades. This one is 1/4" thick, typical of American knives 1840's. When we say a knife was made for the Mexican American War does that mean it only was used in that war? I will try and get some close up pics.

The owner sprays that gold furniture polish on all of his old things for some reason? That is why the wood shines.

 

[TheCoinKid]

I'm thinking you have a Mexican-made knife here. May well be Mexican-American War era. To me, the eagle pommel and overall style screams Mexican manufacture. Any visible stamps?

 

[gunsil]

Oldbattleaxe, why ask when you do not wish to heed replies. Like that abomination of a spear point you posted about. This knife is not at all like a pre-civil war knife. It looks like a Mexican Spanish-American war era knife. Like I said above there is an almost indisputable expert on these kind of knives, and if you don't get a confirmation from him I think you don't really wish to hear the truth, your mind is already made up that it is an early American made knife. In the first set of photos you posted it looked like the knife's guard and pommel were steel, but now it is evident that they are brass. Early American knives almost always had iron or steel hardware. The brass eagle head pommel as noted by another poster screams of Mexican manufacture or possibly European descent. The extreme curve of the clip screams of fake bowie knife, looks like it was re-ground that way from the blades original shape. You talk about the D-guard knives, well at least 90% of those on the market are fakes. Please heed my advice and ask Mr. Levine about this knife. One other expert is Mr. Mark Zalesky, editor of "Knife World" magazine. You could e-mail him at the magazine site and ask him, he is a huge collector of early bowies and another leading expert in the field. Failure to refer to these experts will indicate that you don't really want to know the real origin of the knife. A letter of authenticity from Mr. Levine will increase the knife's value. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing, and a fool and his money are soon parted. It would be truly foolish to spend good money without consulting the real expert. I have been collecting antique military, hunting, and "bowie style" knives for fifty years, and am a life member if the Northeast Cutlery Collectors Association. I know a lot about such knives, but I would still contact the real experts when in doubt. Merry Christmas and good will to all mankind!!

 

[oldbattleaxe]

Gunsil, I also have and owned several knives. I posted the knife to for a couple reasons. One was to get any opinions, which I welcome. I also posted them to share for conversation and maybe one might have a knife like it, or have seen one. I had tried to join Mr Levine's forum and for some reason I had problems signing in a few years ago. If you had read my first post I mentioned it looked Mexican War and also mentioned brass goes from eagle to guard. When I say pre Civil War that means anytime before. Read my first post. For some reason you have it in for me my friend. I will continue to get all of the information I can as I did on the Indian blade and put it to rest. I do not stop with one opinion. I will try and contact Mr. Zalesky If it is possible? You also have a good holiday.

 

[gunsil]

OBA, I most certainly don't have it in for you. I am trying to prevent you from getting burned. I am not referring to Blade Forum, I am referring to e-mail Bernard personally. for some reason this forum didn't seem to accept my writing in Levine's e-mail. Perhaps I can PM it to you. Your knife is definitely a factory produced or perhaps arsenal produced knife. Also remember that the U.S. Army did not issue side knives other than bayonets until WW1. The U.S. Navy and Marines did not issue side knives until WW2. There was the Ames "rifleman's knife" before the civil war, but they are almost non-existent except for a few in museums. You could also try to contact Larry Thomas who owns the American Edged Weapons Museum in Intercourse PA.