It didnt take much, but now giving "no returns" a try.

[insontis]

It didn't take much, but now giving "no returns" a try.

I've only had a small sample size of eBay buys and sells compared to many of you, but I've decided it's time to try the "not accepting returns" when it comes to selling. I've read one of you say before that you use that, but then work with the buyer regardless (just to deter people from trying to push returns). The final straw was one of my more recent "sales".

I was selling a very nice 10K charm bracelet, asking $250 OBO. A buyer put in a first offer of $200 and I came down to meet them at $215 for a sale. Buyer pays immediately, no problem there.

Then, two days later, I inform the buyer I will be shipping the item the next day and that I will let them know the tracking number as soon as it ships.

The buyer then informs me that they were hoping it would have been shipped sooner as it was going to be a birthday present for his wife. He said that he understands stuff happens and thanks me for letting him know.

Next, he sends me another message. This time he says he had to buy a backup present due to not being able to count on my item arriving on time. He asks what my return policy is.

I kindly apologize for the delay and explain my return policy which is straight forward - he pays return shipping and ships it back within 14 days, no problem.

He then responds saying he will ship it back as soon as he receives it. He also states he'd love to keep both, but can't afford to two presents. He asks if I would be willing to send back $50 so that he could afford both.

I respond suggesting that when my item arrives, he allows his wife to pick between the items and then return the one she does not like. I offer that suggestion as well as a more than fair $15 partial refund. This would make the item cost $200, which was his original offer on the item.

He claims the other item he purchased is non returnable. He asks me to split the difference at $25. I accept, but do not love it. I did, however, continue to choose to believe I was being a good seller and helped someone out. I told him I'd refund me the money once he receives the item (via tracking).

He thanks me so very much for making it such a special occasion.

Yesterday he received the item and I almost immediately refunded the $25.

Today he contacts me stating "Hello...just to let you know I will be returning this bracelet for a full refund, its more like a teen bracelet and charms are way to small. I know you refunded me $25 so when you get the bracelet back deduct the 25 you already refunded me...thanks and sorry for any problems"



Now I had posted once before a rant about a buyer who purchased a pair of earrings and claimed that their size was misrepresented when being compared to a standard US dime in a photograph. In this instance, I'm not mad, I'm just done. My photographs for this item were even better at showing size and detail than the earring listing. I included a photograph with the bracelet in comparison to a US quarter as well as a closeup photograph showing the charms next to a ruler. Extremely specific.

What a "teen bracelet" looks like, or how the bracelet looked like one in person, but not in the photographs, I am not sure. Nor am I open to believing there is any misrepresented size/style in the photographs. I am beginning to realize why I see so many sellers with disclaimers like "No returns accepted. Please view photographs carefully as they are a large part of the description. Ask questions prior to bidding. An informed buyer is a great buyer."

Of course I'd be willing to still accept returns if an item is truly represented incorrectly. However, I will be a lot more firm in the future for other instances. I'm thinking no more partial refunds. No returns for buyer's remorse/ignorance. No more jumping through hoops for a buyer - especially before they even receive the item. It's going to be a cut and dry I sell, buyer buys, end of story.

 

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[Iron Patch]

You'll probably still be jumping through the same hoops, the difference is the mindset the buyers will have will probably mean less hoops to jump through.

 

[insontis]

You'll probably still be jumping through the same hoops, the difference is the mindset the buyers will probably mean less hoops to jump through.

I figured as much. I'm just looking to deter people from trying to pull things like this in the future. Heck, by the end of it I kind of feel like he might have been trying to pull something on me. Gets the item at a reduced price, asks for an additional discount and gets it, THEN receives the item and wants to return it. I didn't list the item's weight in the description so maybe he was looking to try and flip it and all of this story he threw out was just BS? I suppose that's just as possible as anything else.

If I do not offer returns - eBay policy would be in line with me as far as buyers remorse instances, right? I mean, eBay wouldn't allow them to return it for reasons such as "I bought another item and now can't afford both". Or claiming the item's size is too small when it was described perfectly accurately. Is that correct? I of course want to work with buyers if I was at fault, but I feel like I put forth the effort to accurately describe an item in detail and, if a sale is made, I should not have to put in double the effort to please the buyer due to their change of heart or lack of judgement.

 

[Indian Steve]

They will just claim the item is not as described and Ebay will give them their money back. Ebay is all for the buyers and sellers can go suck an egg.

 

[apush]

Yes, it seems the gent wanted something for almost nothing. I know the "story" put you on alert. But you were generous by just offering a discount in the first place. He was just a bad apple. I have had my share--but most folks do the right thing. I do have that 14 day return--but I am not sure how I am going to feel about that new return requirement come Christmas time next year.
apush

 

[dumpsterdiver]

I've had two people ask for partial refunds and when I offered a full refund on return I never heard from them. Its like a negotiating technique that only exists on eBay. I also don't have the experience that others here have but I think that is a clue that some people just want something for nothing. But your story is strange enough it might be true. But if it was my wife I would say I ordered your present and its late.

 

[AU_Solitude]

They will just claim the item is not as described and Ebay will give them their money back. Ebay is all for the buyers and sellers can go suck an egg.

This exactly!! I got taken for over $2,500 because of this! I avoid selling on E-bay anymore - they have become a monster.

 

[Iron Patch]

They will just claim the item is not as described and Ebay will give them their money back. Ebay is all for the buyers and sellers can go suck an egg.

True, but you're missing the main point to the post.

 

[Iron Patch]

This exactly!! I got taken for over $2,500 because of this! I avoid selling on E-bay anymore - they have become a monster.

No details - no credibility.

 

[Iron Patch]

I figured as much. I'm just looking to deter people from trying to pull things like this in the future. Heck, by the end of it I kind of feel like he might have been trying to pull something on me. Gets the item at a reduced price, asks for an additional discount and gets it, THEN receives the item and wants to return it. I didn't list the item's weight in the description so maybe he was looking to try and flip it and all of this story he threw out was just BS? I suppose that's just as possible as anything else. If I do not offer returns - eBay policy would be in line with me as far as buyers remorse instances, right? I mean, eBay wouldn't allow them to return it for reasons such as "I bought another item and now can't afford both". Or claiming the item's size is too small when it was described perfectly accurately. Is that correct? I of course want to work with buyers if I was at fault, but I feel like I put forth the effort to accurately describe an item in detail and, if a sale is made, I should not have to put in double the effort to please the buyer due to their change of heart or lack of judgement.

There's no policy change whether you offer returns or not, apart from ebay almost certainly taking a buyers side for any case if you say you'll take them. All you're doing is checking the box not to accept them, and nothing really changes, except you will probably have a better class of buyers who don't play these types of games. When someone offers returns it allows people to buy something they think they might want, and only pay a small penalty to get out of it. If you don't offer returns they won't think that way, they'll expect to have to file a claim and fight to send it back, therefore they will be less likely to get involved in the first place.

 

[jerseyben]

As a buyer, I file claims and ask sellers for refunds all the time. As a seller, I understand why people behave the way they do. Many times the buyer is being rediculous but I find more often than not, the seller did something (intentional or not) to warrant the buyer's behavior.

It has very little to do with ebay and a lot to do with people's abilities to understand what it takes to run a business.

 

[insontis]

There's no policy change whether you offer returns or not, apart from ebay almost certainly taking a buyers side for any case if you say you'll take them. All you're doing is checking the box not to accept them, and nothing really changes, except you will probably have a better class of buyers who don't play these types of games. When someone offers returns it allows people to buy something they think they might want, and only pay a small penalty to get out of it. If you don't offer returns they won't think that way, they'll expect to have to file a claim and fight to send it back, therefore they will be less likely to get involved in the first place.

Well I suppose the few possible benefits will have to do. I haven't ever disputed a request to return an item before. If a buyer received an item that they claim was not described accurately and it was in fact an accurate description, does that mean that an item not as described case could be resolved in my favor? If there is no hope for such a resolution I won't waste my time with ever disputing a case. I'll have to be content with just deterring buyers from the "buy it and try it" mentality.

 

[insontis]

As a buyer, I file claims and ask sellers for refunds all the time. As a seller, I understand why people behave the way they do. Many times the buyer is being rediculous but I find more often than not, the seller did something (intentional or not) to warrant the buyer's behavior.

It has very little to do with ebay and a lot to do with people's abilities to understand what it takes to run a business.

I do not know if you are speaking generally or targeting me in this post. In this sale specifically, the buyer gave three different reasons why he wished to return the item - two before he even received it. I happily worked with him to resolve the issue of him overpaying - an issue which was no fault of mine that I paid out of pocket for. I apologized for the item not being guaranteed to arrive on the day he desired (which he didn't even mention beforehand) - despite having an accurate shipping method and time listed. And as for the final complaint about size - I accepted the return for a full refund.

I don't see how catering to this buyer's every whim has any indication that I don't know what it takes to run a business. I feel that I went well above what most would have. My issue is not that I had to put forth all of this effort - I performed it by choice. I am, however, looking to work smarter and I feel that using the "no returns accepted", or "scarecrow" as I'm beginning to think of it as, will work to filter out buyers who don't know what they want or are looking to get "something for nothing". I am aware this may lead to a potential decrease in sales, but I do know that I lose a chunk of change in shipping expenses for returned high end items. This isn't necessarily a permanent solution, nor is it being applied to all items I have for sale, but it is a worthwhile experiment at the least.

My only inquiry, which ironpatch seemed to answer, was how eBay policy acts in response to "no returns accepted" versus "returns accepted".

 

[trdhrdr007]

There's not much difference between having a 14 day return policy & no return policy. In the end ebay will side with the buyer & you will have to accept returns. People gaming the system know enough to call the item not as described. Having said that, I can see where some of the worst scammers might not bid if there is no return policy. I'm not into adjusting the price after the sale. The buyer can return the item at their expense for a full refund.

I don't want to be offensive, but have an additional comment. It's entirely possible the buyer in this case is one of those people that tries to score items for less than their true value. They see an item that they believe might be underpriced, negotiate the best price they possibly can & "buy" the item knowing the whole time that if their gamble doesn't pay off they will return it for a full refund. Seems like a good deal if you are the buyer.....not so much when you are the seller & realize someone has wasted your time & money.

 

[Joe777Cool]

Insontis - you have clearly had a bit of bad luck lately. The old saying "give them an inch and they will take a mile" seems to apply here. I would NEVER refund someone money after a deal had been done unless I had made some type of mistake. Once you start doing this kind of stuff the flood gates open! Also, one thing working against you in this case is the fact that you took 3 days + to ship the item. As a buyer, this really pisses me off. I can understand slow shipping, but when my item sits for several days before being dinging their shipping time stars and will mention slow shipping in my feedback. All in all I would just stick to whatever return policy you have and not jump through alll these hoops - just tell him to return it and be done with it. If you choose not to accept returns you just need to make sure your listings are as accurate as possible (sounds like you do that already) so you have ammunition against a buyer if and when they open a "not as described case" against you.

 

[FloridaHunter]

There's not much difference between having a 14 day return policy & no return policy. In the end ebay will side with the buyer & you will have to accept returns. People gaming the system know enough to call the item not as described. Having said that, I can see where some of the worst scammers might not bid if there is no return policy. I'm not into adjusting the price after the sale. The buyer can return the item at their expense for a full refund. I don't want to be offensive, but have an additional comment. It's entirely possible the buyer in this case is one of those people that tries to score items for less than their true value. They see an item that they believe might be underpriced, negotiate the best price they possibly can & "buy" the item knowing the whole time that if their gamble doesn't pay off they will return it for a full refund. Seems like a good deal if you are the buyer.....not so much when you are the seller & realize someone has wasted your time & money.

I list almost all of my auctions as no returns. If there is a legitimate problem, I usually work out a deal to give a partial refund. I cannot remember anyone turning down the partial refund. I also block any bidders with more than 4 unpaid items in 6 months, and it blocks a lot of people.

 

[dieselram94]

I always state clearly no returns, please look at pictures carefully before bidding. Not had anyone try to return anything.

sent from a potato...

 

[insontis]

There's not much difference between having a 14 day return policy & no return policy. In the end ebay will side with the buyer & you will have to accept returns. People gaming the system know enough to call the item not as described. Having said that, I can see where some of the worst scammers might not bid if there is no return policy. I'm not into adjusting the price after the sale. The buyer can return the item at their expense for a full refund.

I don't want to be offensive, but have an additional comment. It's entirely possible the buyer in this case is one of those people that tries to score items for less than their true value. They see an item that they believe might be underpriced, negotiate the best price they possibly can & "buy" the item knowing the whole time that if their gamble doesn't pay off they will return it for a full refund. Seems like a good deal if you are the buyer.....not so much when you are the seller & realize someone has wasted your time & money.

I don't feel you are being offensive at all. I actually half suspected that the buyer was doing that. Like I said, I went down on my price to meet him for the sale. Then, after I shipped the item, but effort he received it, he basically gave me an ultimatum - accept a return for full refund or give him a partial refund. He gets the partial refund and STILL wants to return it. This time for a different reason and one that implies they simply don't like the piece - no way to fix this. Not like he could ask for more money off - according to him the partial refund covered his financial issue with the item. So yeah, assuming he was trying to get the item for a flip this whole story makes sense.

Joe - yes I have had a few unlucky runs with eBay as of late, but I post all of them. Mainly to get feedback from everyone about how to fix it for the future and so that others can learn from my mistakes. I don't post the positive outcomes much :P

 

[clovis97]

Personally, I don't bid or buy much from those with a 'no returns' policy.

In the tool and trains categories where I shop the most, I find, generally speaking, that the sellers have a little something to hide with their item. Sometimes they use trick photography, sometimes they play the "find the defect on your own" game, or use the "not tested (but I know it is junk)" game.

My worst experiences have been with sellers using "no returns", so I steer clear of them, for the most part.

 

[dieselram94]

Personally, I don't bid or buy much from those with a 'no returns' policy.

In the tool and trains categories where I shop the most, I find, generally speaking, that the sellers have a little something to hide with their item. Sometimes they use trick photography, sometimes they play the "find the defect on your own" game, or use the "not tested (but I know it is junk)" game.

My worst experiences have been with sellers using "no returns", so I steer clear of them, for the most part.

The reason I do no returns is because most items I sell are things I don't need anymore. Once there gone I want them to stay gone. I am starting to get into it a little more so if I do I may offer returns on SOME items. I would hope my 100% feedback rating would calm a buyers nerves about my no returns policy...

sent from a potato...