Is it possible to file calim on DNR land placer deposits in washington state?

[Ragnor]

Is it possible to file claim on DNR land placer deposits in washington state?

I am well aware we have the right to file claim on federal forest lands, but what about state owned lands? Is BLM and DNR lands the same?
I know of an area locally that has a bit of gold. I asked the game department if I could operate suction equipment there as it falls outside of the normal gold and fish rules as I understand them. It's a seasonal ditch that holds water and does not actually drain into the river year round. It also happens to be a high bench/ ancient river channel.
Well the wildlife biologists wants to see the location in order to make a determination if I need a permit or not despite my vary detailed description of the situation.
Well I really don't want to go showing anyone my secret gold discovery , let alone a government official from such a notorious agency as WDFW.
I am wondering is there a way to protect my discovery? and the adjacent deposit which logically exists on the next section of that old channel?
I really don't wanna give up my spot, but I also don't want to get in trouble for violating the state mining laws.

This is one of those spots that nobody, like literally almost nobody is old enough to know the history and very few people who did hear of it ever paid attention. But if it goes public I expect someone with more money than me would be happy to start a new gravel pit on the secondary location if they took time to sample it.

 

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[stefen]

I'll answer a portion of your question..."Is BLM and DNR lands the same?"

One is federal and the other is state. Separate entities.

You best bet is to obtain maps of the area of concern and determine what agency actually has jurisdiction.

Once you are armed with this knowledge, then approach the appropriate agency and and ask 'Broad-Brush' questions applicable to one or more 'Encircled Areas'.

As you are able to climb the ladder, ask and determine answers to more minute aspects.

Possibly, permits are or are not warranted, and its possible that agency underlings use such tactics to limit access.

Asking the wrong person or agency rep is comparable to asking a kid at a gas station where there's a good place to eat...

 

[SpecJet]

From everything I've read, State lands are generally leased, granted I have not looked at Washington specifically.

Here in California, prospecting on State lands without a permit is a big no-no.

 

[Clay Diggins]

If you don't know the status of the land you are entering to prospect you shouldn't be there. If those were State lands you were prospecting on you were trespassing.

Washington State requires a paid prospecting lease to even sample the State lands. They won't give anyone a lease for wetlands.

IF the land you were interested in entering were dry uplands you still couldn't get a lease because you obviously know nothing about prospecting.

From the Prospecting Lease terms and conditions:

Qualifications
To be successful in your lease or contract application you'll need to demonstrate:

Formal education or documentation of the equivalent of two years of post high-school education in earth science, geology, mining, or other related field from an accredited institution of higher learning.
Documentation of the equivalent of two years experience in the exploration for potential, commercially viable coal or metallic mineral, industrial mineral, or aggregate properties (as is appropriate for the application you are seeking).
Documentation of the equivalent of two years experience in mining engineering, mining, or mine/property development of a commercially viable mining property.

Validity
All applicants, except those applying as an individual(s), must be authorized to do business in the state of Washington. A valid UBI number from the Washington State Department of Revenue is required on the application from all businesses. This includes corporations or other businesses that are licensed to do business in other states or counties.

Financial capability
You must demonstrate at least one of the following:

Documentation of the ability to conduct and fund initial exploration to determine the potential of a mineral prospect.
Documentation of the ability to obtain capital for mineral exploration and/or development of a commercially viable mineral prospect.
(Mineral prospecting leases only) Documentation of ability to joint venture or contract with others who have the ability to obtain or provide capital for mineral exploration and/or development of a property leading to production of a commercially viable mining property.

History
Those not converting a mineral prospecting lease to a mining contract cannot apply for or receive a new mineral prospecting lease for the same lease area until a year after the prior lease's experation date.

Verification
To apply for a lease or contract you'll need to provide:​

All supporting documentation, and
Proof of liability insurance, and a performance security upon signing the contract.

If you want to prospect the State lands you are going to have to get educated and be able to prove you can carry out and afford mineral deposit development on the uplands. Money and education.

Just prospecting wherever you please without knowledge of the land status and laws is a dangerous hobby. I suggest you join a prospecting club to learn more about prospecting and so you will know that you are where you have the right to be.

Heavy Pans

 

[SpecJet]

Damn....That's rough.
I guess those kinds of requirements keep out the riff-raff.

 

[mike(swWash)]

Wash, state land is open to prospecting but cannot be claimed, only federal lands are claimable here.

 

[Clay Diggins]

Damn....That's rough.
I guess those kinds of requirements keep out the riff-raff.

I thought Washington State was pretty easy.

In Arizona there is a 6 page application and $4,560 per Section for a 2 year prospecting permit that takes about 45 days to process. If you don't meet their standards or they just decide not to issue the permit you are out the additional $500 application fee. If they do approve you need to reapply every year even though you pay for two years up front. After all that you can't mine on your prospecting permit.

Heavy Pans

 

[Clay Diggins]

Wash, state land is open to prospecting but cannot be claimed, only federal lands are claimable here.

Open to prospecting with permit and only on the dry uplands... no wetlands. No claims.

Different permit required for mining.

Heavy Pans

 

[et1955]

Show us the gold you are finding and tell us how much material you had to process to get it, have you tested to see if the deposit it is on the surface or dose it keep going in, if so how far in. How much gold are you finding per cubic yard, don't guess but test. Is it worth the expense and aggravation to mine this area the way you have chosen. Check out the thread " Today's Take " here on the T.N. and you will see what I and my friends find on the Skykomish, that is running about 4 to 6 buckets only per day. P.M me and I will educate you more about mining in this state, I have over 40 years experience mining in this state plus you mentioned old timers, well back in the 1970's and 1980's I met several old timers, long gone now but not forgotten, they gave me a great gift and that was there knowledge of places to mine, all are recorded in my map book. Ed

 

[Ragnor]

This has always been my understanding, that the gold and fish pamphlet acts as the permit . As of the new revision the pamphlet is no longer required to be on-site.

 

[Ragnor]

You strike me as a rather abrasive fellow Clay. I had reviewed the area enough to know that it is DNR managed state lands. The part I had not gotten to was weather the lands could be claimed or had to be leased. Knowing that I would need an 'educated' partner for the operation, well that is helpful and I thank you for that.

Here in Washington the gold and fish rules book qualifies as a permit for prospecting on state lands, but state parks are closed to prospecting. Last time I read the book.

If you don't know the status of the land you are entering to prospect you shouldn't be there. If those were State lands you were prospecting on you were trespassing.

Washington State requires a paid prospecting lease to even sample the State lands. They won't give anyone a lease for wetlands.

IF the land you were interested in entering were dry uplands you still couldn't get a lease because you obviously know nothing about prospecting.

From the Prospecting Lease terms and conditions:


If you want to prospect the State lands you are going to have to get educated and be able to prove you can carry out and afford mineral deposit development on the uplands. Money and education.

Just prospecting wherever you please without knowledge of the land status and laws is a dangerous hobby. I suggest you join a prospecting club to learn more about prospecting and so you will know that you are where you have the right to be.

Heavy Pans

 

[Ragnor]

I know the fine gold is present in a several square mile area around this location and I have pulled pickers from the bedrock and false bedrock in the area. I have not done any proper sampling beyond knowing there is fines everywhere in the area and course gold on the bedrock. I just recently realized the potential of the old bench (I got some new info given to me). Next time I get in there I'll have to do some real sampling and I'll share the results. It's a long steep hike and things have been a wee bit damp and hills have been moving a little more than I like to be out in that spot just now.

Show us the gold you are finding and tell us how much material you had to process to get it, have you tested to see if the deposit it is on the surface or dose it keep going in, if so how far in. How much gold are you finding per cubic yard, don't guess but test. Is it worth the expense and aggravation to mine this area the way you have chosen. Check out the thread " Today's Take " here on the T.N. and you will see what I and my friends find on the Skykomish, that is running about 4 to 6 buckets only per day. P.M me and I will educate you more about mining in this state, I have over 40 years experience mining in this state plus you mentioned old timers, well back in the 1970's and 1980's I met several old timers, long gone now but not forgotten, they gave me a great gift and that was there knowledge of places to mine, all are recorded in my map book. Ed

 

[Clay Diggins]

You strike me as a rather abrasive fellow Clay. I had reviewed the area enough to know that it is DNR managed state lands. The part I had not gotten to was weather the lands could be claimed or had to be leased. Knowing that I would need an 'educated' partner for the operation, well that is helpful and I thank you for that.

Here in Washington the gold and fish rules book qualifies as a permit for prospecting on state lands, but state parks are closed to prospecting. Last time I read the book.

You are welcome Ragnor.

You don't know the half of it Ragnor. I actually want people to be aware of the facts about land status.

I'm so abrasive I've even been known to share that information publicly when people ask for information on a public forum! Horrors!!!

You might want to read that pamphlet again.

From page 8 of your Gold and Fish Pamphlet:

Washington Department of Natural Resources (WDNR)
Aquatic Resources Division

"The requirement for anyone wishing to conduct any type
of prospecting, mining and metal detecting on state-
owned aquatic lands to obtain a use authorization prior to
commencing operations will be determined on a case-by-case
basis after considering all proprietary interests of the state.

Proponents wishing to conduct any type of prospecting,
mining and metal detecting on state-owned aquatic lands
must file an application with the aquatic district office
responsible for the proposed location of the operations to
begin the determination process Some uses may be allowed
with no restrictions, while others may be allowed only with
certain conditions that ensure WDNR is fulfilling the
statutory management guidelines listed in RCW 79 105 030"

Heavy Permits

 

[et1955]

It's funny but it sounds like the Sultan River you are mining, I have many ancient river beds I mine there, I don't know what you consider a picker but on the Sultan 1/4 inch to 1/2 is typical, Ed

 

[et1955]

Aquatic lands are swamps or lakes up here, very protected.

 

[Clay Diggins]

RCW 79.105.060
Definitions.
The definitions in this section apply throughout chapters 79.105 through 79.145 RCW unless the context clearly requires otherwise.
(1) "Aquatic lands" means all tidelands, shorelands, harbor areas, and the beds of navigable waters.

Heavy Pans

 

[Ragnor]

I see your point, I had avoided calling it a frog pond for a reason.

You are welcome Ragnor.

You don't know the half of it Ragnor. I actually want people to be aware of the facts about land status.

I'm so abrasive I've even been known to share that information publicly when people ask for information on a public forum! Horrors!!!

You might want to read that pamphlet again.

From page 8 of your Gold and Fish Pamphlet:

Washington Department of Natural Resources (WDNR)
Aquatic Resources Division

"The requirement for anyone wishing to conduct any type
of prospecting, mining and metal detecting on state-
owned aquatic lands to obtain a use authorization prior to
commencing operations will be determined on a case-by-case
basis after considering all proprietary interests of the state.

Proponents wishing to conduct any type of prospecting,
mining and metal detecting on state-owned aquatic lands
must file an application with the aquatic district office
responsible for the proposed location of the operations to
begin the determination process Some uses may be allowed
with no restrictions, while others may be allowed only with
certain conditions that ensure WDNR is fulfilling the
statutory management guidelines listed in RCW 79 105 030"

Heavy Permits

 

[Ragnor]

It had crossed my mind if the values could be proven to call it a fish habitat improvement project.
Create spawning beds, brewding areas, flow control stuff like that.

 

[russau]

I think the saying of: "If we repeat it enough , eventually it will become fact"! I keep thinking this everytime I read someone calling public land as ,BLM, FS, C.O.E. lands! I know we know the difference and sometimes its just EZer to call it their lands BUT the gubermint is also doing this ! Ive done it myself and I catch myself and stop in the middle of what im saying.Im NOT trying to point out anyone for doing this or "preaching to the choir" because we all know this info! I just feel that we need to keep this in mind when putting ANYTHING on the net! This is a GREAT site and Clay and his site (MY Land Matters) is PRICELESS with info! THANKYOU! Time for me to get off my box!

 

[goldenIrishman]

You strike me as a rather abrasive fellow Clay. I had reviewed the area enough to know that it is DNR managed state lands. The part I had not gotten to was weather the lands could be claimed or had to be leased. Knowing that I would need an 'educated' partner for the operation, well that is helpful and I thank you for that.

Here in Washington the gold and fish rules book qualifies as a permit for prospecting on state lands, but state parks are closed to prospecting. Last time I read the book.

No offense intended here Ragnor but Clay is only giving you the truth and believe it or not, his only interest is to see that miners everywhere know the laws as well as how to apply them to our benefit. Truth is truth and should never need to be candy coated. That's for lies and misinformation like the kind that the environmental groups use against us all the time.

When we as miners operate outside of the laws of the areas we are working in, it only gives those that are fighting to shut mining down more ammo to use against us. It's bad enough that the envirowackos use false science against us and have it accepted by the public and courts as scientific facts. To prospect or mine in areas that require a permit from the state without having that permit is again giving them more ammo to shut us down. This is why it is so very important for the future of mining at all scales for us to learn and follow the laws to the letter. Sure, stand up for your rights, but be sure you've got the legal backing behind you and your operations.