Infinium... arrrrrrg

[G.I.B.]

Okay, day 3 in the water with the new Infinium.

I know for a sure I'm missing targets in the water.

I was waist deep in really calm salt water in St. Pete Beach this morning. Nice and calm, like a lake.
Wheeeeee-haaaaaaaaaaaaaa-weeeeeeeeeee-haaaaaaaaa-weeeeeee and so on.

Just a slight bit of water movement from the waves makes the machine sing the see-saw song. Two hours with a PI machine on a crowded beach and all I get is a pop top pull tab and two bobbypins. I knew by the sound that it was a bobby pin both times, but dug to be sure. Very loud, as it has to be loud to beat the surf weeee-haaaaa sounds.

So I go up to the shallow ankle deep water. The machine is now mostly quiet except when a wave washes over the coil. In the surf it's singing 95% of the time. Shallow ankle deep water, singing 10%. So now that the machine is quiet I can really hear stuff. I start hitting crap all over, just like when I'm using my SandShark.

The junk is here. The junk is in waist deep water too, just can not hear it over the wave sounds. Well, most of it over the wave sounds.

So this lady lost a necklace on the dry sand and asks for help. It's a small very fine gold chain with a small gold star and diamond on it. The Infinium whispers at the chain, just a whisper on the tip of the coil. Unable to pinpoint the chain as usual, just getting the faint whispers. We find the chain by kicking around in the sand.

Anyhow, I plant the chain and can't find it with the coil, not hearing it very well. Just the whisper. Put down my wife's small gold ring, nice and sharp sounds, not terrifically loud, but locatable.

My big problem is that I can't hear gold very well over the surf heeeee-haaaaw.

Am I the only one with this problem? Is there a cure?

Here is some of the junk I found, posted it in the beach and shallow water section as well... The bobby pins were in the surf with the pull tabs. The bottle caps were in the very shallow water, and coins in dry sand.

 

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[Indasurf]

GIB, Sent you PM!

N/T

 

[John-Edmonton]

When you get into the 4 foot water mark, lower the whole box under water and it should run more stable.

 

[scrooge]

I see Indasurf sent you a PM so you might have already received the below instructions. Its does seem odd that a machine you can use in the water will only remain stable with the control unit submerged. That was one of the things I told Garrett was happening with my unit. I was told the unit was sensitive but should not be picking up the wave action and was told it may a shielding problem with the coil.

(1) First, turn the unit into the LOCK position. Then listen for any interference and use the frequency adjustments to eliminate any interference. Remember to move the frequency adjustment a small amount and then wait for a small period of time for it to lock in. Remember, there are 32 frequency positions that can be obtained with this control. Once you get use to the unit, you will generally get to know where the quietest spots are and it will come second nature and quick to do this.
(2) Do not try and adjust the frequency control with the unit in Fast or Slow Track. What I have found, is that sometimes the auto track tries to lock onto the interference, making it hard to eliminate it.
(3) Set the threshold so as you can only just here it and set the discrimination to "0" .
Now comes the important steps and if this isn't done correctly, false signals and sounds can occur.
(4) Turn the unit to Fast Track. Move the coil up and down to the sand a few times and place the coil directly onto the sand for about 10 seconds. Then again move the coil up and down to the sand a few more times. You will see that that the ground balance has come in very quickly and should be fairly steady.
(5) Then switch it to Slow Track and then repeat the same procedure as was done in Fast track. This is the fine tuning adjustments.
Please note, when you place the coil directly onto the ground, the unit tends to keep ground balancing the ground effects out, and you will find that it quietens down pretty quick. This is especially more noticable in the high mineralized ground in the goldfields.
(6) Once this has been done, switch the unit to lock.
(7) As the unit was designed for prospecting, it doesn't have the prefixed discrimination set to compensate for salt water effects, as other beach PI units have. If you still get any affects from the salt water, you may have to increase the discrimination up to about "2" to eliminate these false signals. I haven't had any problems with noisy operation going from the dry sand, to the wet sand and into the water with the unit ground balance set correctly. Generally I use it with "0" discrimination set.
(Cool As the unit was designed for prospecting, it has a lot more sensitivity than a normal beach PI unit. To drop the sensitivity, use the threshold and reduce it, even to "0" and this will also help reduce any false signals you may be getting. By doing this, you will not miss any targets normally associated with beach/water detecting, eg:- coins, rings and chains.
(9) If you come to an area in the water that is causing a lot of problems, then ground balance over this problem area and then switch it to lock. This should sort out any problems.

 

[G.I.B.]

Okay guys, thanks for all the help and advice.

I am fully submerging the control box, and have tried some of the tips. I'll try more today and see if that helps.

This is what makes TN so great, all the wonderful help to a guy with a new detector.

I'll let you know how it turns out. I really like the machine, I've just got to work through the learning curve.

 

[Indasurf]

I see Indasurf sent you a PM so you might have already received the below instructions. Its does seem odd that a machine you can use in the water will only remain stable with the control unit submerged. That was one of the things I told Garrett was happening with my unit. I was told the unit was sensitive but should not be picking up the wave action and was told it may a shielding problem with the coil.

(1) First, turn the unit into the LOCK position. Then listen for any interference and use the frequency adjustments to eliminate any interference. Remember to move the frequency adjustment a small amount and then wait for a small period of time for it to lock in. Remember, there are 32 frequency positions that can be obtained with this control. Once you get use to the unit, you will generally get to know where the quietest spots are and it will come second nature and quick to do this.
(2) Do not try and adjust the frequency control with the unit in Fast or Slow Track. What I have found, is that sometimes the auto track tries to lock onto the interference, making it hard to eliminate it.
(3) Set the threshold so as you can only just here it and set the discrimination to "0" .
Now comes the important steps and if this isn't done correctly, false signals and sounds can occur.
(4) Turn the unit to Fast Track. Move the coil up and down to the sand a few times and place the coil directly onto the sand for about 10 seconds. Then again move the coil up and down to the sand a few more times. You will see that that the ground balance has come in very quickly and should be fairly steady.
(5) Then switch it to Slow Track and then repeat the same procedure as was done in Fast track. This is the fine tuning adjustments.
Please note, when you place the coil directly onto the ground, the unit tends to keep ground balancing the ground effects out, and you will find that it quietens down pretty quick. This is especially more noticable in the high mineralized ground in the goldfields.
(6) Once this has been done, switch the unit to lock.
(7) As the unit was designed for prospecting, it doesn't have the prefixed discrimination set to compensate for salt water effects, as other beach PI units have. If you still get any affects from the salt water, you may have to increase the discrimination up to about "2" to eliminate these false signals. I haven't had any problems with noisy operation going from the dry sand, to the wet sand and into the water with the unit ground balance set correctly. Generally I use it with "0" discrimination set.
(Cool As the unit was designed for prospecting, it has a lot more sensitivity than a normal beach PI unit. To drop the sensitivity, use the threshold and reduce it, even to "0" and this will also help reduce any false signals you may be getting. By doing this, you will not miss any targets normally associated with beach/water detecting, eg:- coins, rings and chains.
(9) If you come to an area in the water that is causing a lot of problems, then ground balance over this problem area and then switch it to lock. This should sort out any problems.

I've never had to submerge the control box. I'm not saying that this doesen't help, but I've only needed to follow the setup instructions mentioned above to the letter!!!

I work this detector over real "bad black" sand and now have it running very smoothly. In my area, I usually need to run the disc between 2 & 3 to cancel out the salt and at these levels there's deep targets I almost don't want to dig (LOL)!

Garrett recommends not going past "3" in the disc mode! I would say the average setting I use the "most" would be between "2" & "2 1/2". Strange though, on the same beach sometimes I can run it a near "0". I guess this has to do with the changing salt mineral content?

This tip called "The frequency adjust trick" was discovered by Black Davy and seems to have helped plenty of hunters in the past. Years ago, Black Davy contacted Garrett for possible answers with this finding too.


hermsie62 I was just working highly minerized beaches in Maine. I tried all kinds of combos with slow lock fast discrimination and threshold. The one thing that worked for me a going to frequency adjust mode turn the knob all the way to max and then back to zero as to still keep all 96 frequencies and then take it out of frequency adjust. This has given me the best performance yet and a ultra quite unit. I do not know why this worked but it did. It can't hurt to try and see if it gets rid of some of the falsing.

Hope this helps!

Thanks

 

[ReidMan]

Never had a problem with mine, it's the quitest detector I have ever used in the wet sand. And as for the it wouldn't pick up the chain in the dry sand, detector is crap in dry sand or non-mineralized soil use a VLF for that.

 

[G.I.B.]

As my beach hours with this machine increase, so do my skills.

It truly takes time to learn this, along with its little 'quirks'.

I am getting better with it every day, and I really like the machine.

 

[Detector Wars]

As my beach hours with this machine increase, so do my skills.

It truly takes time to learn this, along with its little 'quirks'.

I am getting better with it every day, and I really like the machine.

Did you manage to solve the noise problem in the water?

 

[G.I.B.]

Yes, it was several things combined to quiet it down.

Keeping a tight wire from the coil to the control box. Correct balancing, correct adjustments of the Discrim and Threshold...

Now, if my new SS beach scoop would ever get here...

 

[Detector Wars]

Yes, it was several things combined to quiet it down.

Keeping a tight wire from the coil to the control box. Correct balancing, correct adjustments of the Discrim and Threshold...

Now, if my new SS beach scoop would ever get here...

Where do you set your discrim and threshold now?

 

[G.I.B.]

Discrim is up about 3.5 and threshold is at zero when i'm deep in the surf, chest high.

I'm learning how to adjust it for when I'm shallower and the control box is out of the water, which brings the threshold up a little, and the discrim down.

Then as I hunt with me dry, in the wet sand, I can move the threshold up to about 4 and lower the discrim to around 1.

I got lazy using the turn on and go GTA 2500 (it remembers what I like)

 

[Detector Wars]

Thanks GIB,
but you might be loosing a lot of depth in those settings, maybe. I don't think other Infinium users had to adjust it that much judging from some of the other posts that I've read but I could be wrong.

I will check next time I go in the water, I have an 8" mono and if it does the same thing then I'll know that it's the detector.

 

[G.I.B.]

Thanks GIB,
but you might be loosing a lot of depth in those settings, maybe. I don't think other Infinium users had to adjust it that much judging from some of the other posts that I've read but I could be wrong.

I will check next time I go in the water, I have an 8" mono and if it does the same thing then I'll know that it's the detector.

If I don't take the Discrimination up that high I listen to the waves as they go by and it drives me bug-nuts.

 

[Indasurf]

I've needed to run the disc as high as "3" & "3 1/2" in some areas but rarely. The machine was still hitting on deep signals at those settings. This was usually with the stock coil and I find the disc settings are a bit lower for me with the 8" mono coil.


Thanks!

 

[Goldringer]

Mine too. Just got a new Infinium and it works OK on the beach dry sand and in the surf up to knee deep. Once i get out waist deep it becomes useless. Nothing but full volume hi-lo or lo-hi signals. I have many other machines and have been in the water for 20 years. This Infinium is very sensitive to small iron but minimun sensitive to the gold I am after. It is in it's brand new condition useless in salt water deeper than your knees. I emailed Garrett on Friday and will call them on Monday for a solution. Ground balanced several times with no improvement. I can't hear any electrical/RF interference but did adjust anyway with no change. I can crank the discrimination all the way with no improvement. Once I get waist deep the only way to stabilize the machine is to raise the coil out of the water or shut the machine off. it will run OK till it hits a target then goes full, unstopable volume. Is it junk in salt water. I have read several similar complaints in various forums.

 

[G.I.B.]

Greetings Goldringer,

I've finally got my machine to settle down in the salt water. I don't know if it was something by magical mystical force or a combination of the suggestions I received here on TN, but I too thought it was worthless in salt water.

My coil wire is nice and tight all the way up the shaft, no floppy wires. I'm not hip mounting it any longer. I had spent lots of time ground balancing it over and over again. During my hunt, stop and balance it. Change freq's, adjust this and that.

I finally have found where my Infini works in the Florida salt water with a Disc of 3.3 or so, and the Threshold just above zero.

This is my default water setting, which I adjust per conditions, but not very far.

Dry sand is different, I can open it up.

In the wet though, I'm starting to hear what it is the coil is over. I'm still digging for confirmation, but I'm getting much better at it.

I hated the machine at first... but now I really have grown to trust it.

Don't know how true it is, but someone told me that the more you ground balance it and the more you use it in 'like' conditions, the more the machine behaves for you. A little at a time it gets happier and happier where you are at.

Stick with it and follow all the little tips. You will be pleased!

 

[scrooge]

I use mine in the Atlantic ocean in Florida and was having similar problems; posted the same questions here and on other forums only to find most owners have had some type of problems with the machine.

Here is what I have learned after a year of owning the Infinium, It has been sent in twice for repairs that included the DD coil being replaced both times (shielding problems), a loose solider connection on the circuit board and recalibration on the second trip. The folks at Garrett were great , they fielded my questions and made the repairs at no charge as they were covered under warranty. Once I got my Infinium back I read posts where users did everything from turning the threshold all the way past max and back, to running the unit with the threshold at zero and a ton of other things. I decided to conduct my own test so I took my Infinium with the DD coil to my local beach dug two six inch deep holes in the dry sand tied a strings to a 14K ring and 10K ring buried each in a separate hole, ground balanced the machine set the threshold at 4 and listened (the 4 setting on my unit is just above silent) and I was able to run the discrimination at zero......as I increased the discrimination the obvious happened past 4 the unit began to give erratic signals and could not identify the rings . The below 4 the unit had no problem giving the HI/LO but as I decreased the threshold to zero the unit had a harder time identifying the rings and the tone seemed to give off echos. I then moved to wet sand and conducted the same experiment and had similar results but to get the unit relatively quite I had to move the discrimination to 1. That being said it still gave the HI/LO.... until the discrimination was turned past 4 the results were the same as the dry sand...I have never been able to get the unit really quite in the surf but it is better since the last trip in for repairs.
Here are some tones my machine makes on certain items: zinc pennies give an echo as the coil comes to the end of the swing. Bottle caps give a HI/LO but the LO tone seems drawn out or longer , bobby pins have there own distinct sound. Clad coins LO/HI. These sounds are what I have found on my unit it may or may not be that way for others. MOST IMPORTANTLY SLOOOOOW DOWN THE SWING!!!!!!! I have used a Whites Pi for twenty years and could swing it much faster than the Infinium. I found that slowing down the swing has allowed me to find deeper items I was missing, as the coil approaches a target you will start to hear a tonal change even if you don't get a solid signal( HI/LO or LO/HI). If this happens I stop then go over the area extremely slow to check for a solid signal.

My opinion of the Infinium: it is a deep PI machine but I can't say it is any deeper than my Whites PI , with the DD coil it is heavy , not a machine for beginners,costumer service was great. Over all in spite of the problems I have still found clad coins, silver jewelery (really seems to like silver) and a nice 3 gram 10K gold medallion plus the expected ton of junk from using a PI machine. If I had it to do again I would have purchased the Whites duel field but that's just me....