HELLO, I AM KING OF THE PARK. WHAT ARE YOU DOING HERE?

[re-tek]

so yesterday i'm MD'ing at a tot lot and a guy in a city shirt comes and asks what is that machine in my hand for. i explain to him its a metal detector and i'm looking for coins. he gives me this whole discourse on the fact that i need to go find him and let him know what i'm doing before i start using the detector in the park.

being of cuban parents i already figured out that this guy is cuban and recently got to miami, hence comes with castros mentallity of block captains and all that other commie stuff they have going on over there...

so i told the guy "nope". we're not in a communist country, i dont need to go find him for clearance, this is a city park open to the public, i'm within my rights, i've already researched where i can and cant detect and city parks allow detectors.

then he pulls the 911 card one me and says that i need to check in with him because i may be planting a bomb with all this electronic stuff i'm carrying. at this point i'm amused.. i look at him and look around the park and tell him that someones gonna blow up the playground?!?

he admits its farfetched and backs off but walks away saying i should check in with him as a courtesy. i got some clad and moved on to another tot lot after 45 minutes or so.

anybody else had similar experiences?

 

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[jrf30]

I think i know that guy! I have seen him in numerous parks at numerous times, all through the west. So, he must travel.

Either it was him, or his mental twin brothers that I have seen.

Just be careful. If they think they have some power, they many times try to exert it. I had one guy threaten to arrest me. I said that was a joke, and he tried to wrestle me to the ground. PHysically! And I had headsets on, wires all over, and a machine with a long handle that was easily bent or broken. I told him to stop, and left. At my car I called the police. They came, but somehow this "ranger" was nowhere to be found. And they denied he ever existed so I dropped it.

head jobs are called head jobs though for a reason. So, as they said on Hil Street Blues each week, "be careful out there".

 

[soar697877]

Yes, I have had a similar experience. I told the guy the same thing basically, as you did.
I am sorry that they are not educated enough to understand the aspects of our hobby, and the clearly ludicrous remarks they make. I will continue to uphold the metal detector code of ethics anytime I am out, but I will not be bullied by anyone, either.

We as Hobbyists (Metal detectorist) need to uphold our rights as well.
We have just as much right as any other people (sports,etc..) to be in a public park,
as long as you are not digging to china with a bulldozer,etc and covering any shallow holes
with plugs, etc. there should not be any issue. Man, I guess some people just need to
quit being jelous of us all !!! LOL...

 

[re-tek]

I guess it'd be to easy to just say "OK" and make an alliance.

You probably don't realize that while you are pounding your chest in pride, you are at the same time adding more nails to the coffin (so to speak) for those wanting to close parks for MDing.

packing up and leaving as soon as your threatened is not a solution either.

 

[soar697877]

I guess it'd be to easy to just say "OK" and make an alliance.

You probably don't realize that while you are pounding your chest in pride, you are at the same time adding more nails to the coffin (so to speak) for those wanting to close parks for MDing.

SWR,

But if you just say "OK" and move out swiftly every time someone without the mental capacity to understand the nature of your hobby tells you to leave without merit, then isn't that the same thing as your ultimate conclusion
You said "adding more nails to the coffin (so to speak) for those wanting to close parks for MDing"....well in essence, if we all put our tail between our legs and scatter away from PUBLIC
land, then that is exactly the same, closing parks to metal detectorists,right?!!!!

It may not effect everyone at the same time, but guess what? Eventually, it will get to every state, closing ALL PUBLIC land to Metal detectorists !!!

How would ya like that, SWR?

 

[soar697877]

Let's make it illegal to treasure hunt in all coastal waters as well while we are at it?
All Beaches, even all US vessells at sea. Wow, think of the ramifications....

 

[Rob66]

The guy was bored!!!!!!!

This is what you should say next time.

"I am a federal agent on a secret mission, there better not be any nails,razor or object that may hurt a child here. I'm sure you've been doing you job officer......"

Then give him the evil eye.


works for me.



He was bored....

"I think I go pick on girl...... with metal detector or bomb !!!"

"This is a high alert situration."

As long as you did your home work and left no trails. "Good for you." 8)


RD

 

[soar697877]

Does his city code state that a metal detectorist "check in" with a park employee before
proceeding on his hobby? I bet not...Heck, we dont have "park employees stationed at the parks around here at all...so ya mean I would have to drive around looking for a park employee to advise him (not ask permission) I am at a certain park? I don't think so...

Do the other people conducting their hobby do the same thing? You know, the walkers, the sports guys/girls, etc....? Nope.

Sorry, unless it specifies in his city code to do otherwise, I don't feel I would "HAVE TO SEEK HIM OUT" to "advise" him of anything.

 

[Rob66]

Check in, please......You are only asking for trouble......You do your research you call the park and they say yes it is allowed.

Then you check in, so you can have some miss informed worker tells you NO.


Why check in so they can say O.K it a metal detector.

But forget what's in the big box in back of my truck.

Silly power trip.

Next it wil be check in your fishing poles,your bikes, your kids, your wife, your clorox bleach.

Most parks I go to, you check in anyway got to pay to play.

 

[soar697877]

My view is that unless they have EVERYONE "check-in" if they are attempting some sort of security check then fine, if not then it is pointless. We could debate this on and on and on....

Bottom line is this:


"It is called AMERICA, the land of Civil Liberties and the pursuit of happiness"

 

[jeff of pa]

Like it or not, we live in a Very Frightened Country.
I'm sure their are still people out there with such big heads
that are still afraid to open un marked envalopes
for fear of the terrorists want them. :P

I would have said sure no problem
simply to keep the site open & make
the guy happy. after 2 or 3 times they would
probably get to know your face
and say just go at it from now on.
They probably get reports regularly
from these frightened people.

 

[soar697877]

You do have a valid point Jeff. That is a good suggestion, as long as the
"park people" are truly only making sure we are on the up & up, and not
trying to take away civil liberties. If someone says "ok" , etc. and next time
the "park people" continue with the harrasment (yes, that is what it is)
then what, even though you relented the last time, etc.?


I didn't realize that carrying a detector would make us look like terrorists.

 

[Rob66]

I don't believe America likes to live in fear.The real fear which I think will happen is an attack on our technology, that's where the real fears lye's if you were thrown back in the dark ages in one nite will you survive?

 

[re-tek]

to clear something up.. i was in no way aggressive to the guy but did hold my ground. seemed like park guy gone homeland security agent!

after our quick exchange he seemed like he figured out that i did my research. i dont think anything like a massive park closure will come of this little stint. being in a big city, these guys have things like drug dealers and vandals to wory about constantly. nerds with metal detectors arent their excitement for the day.

the next park i went to was much bigger and a whole lot busier. there was 3 kids on the roof of the rec center building. the park staff was no where to be found.

 

[jeff of pa]

You do have a valid point Jeff. That is a good suggestion, as long as the
"park people" are truly only making sure we are on the up & up, and not
trying to take away civil liberties. If someone says "ok" , etc. and next time
the "park people" continue with the harrasment (yes, that is what it is)
then what, even though you relented the last time, etc.?


I didn't realize that carrying a detector would make us look like terrorists.

I think it is lame also, but as I said, a few times
of stopping in & Saying your there, Maybe asking if he
ever heard any history on the area, & pretty much
being known. helps.

Problem is, you can't turn on the news or weather anymore
without them reminding you what the "Terror Level" Is.
that is also Terrorisim, to the meek

 

[gallileo60]

Never heard of checking in at a city park, State Park maybe, city, no...Damn Commie...lol...

 

[soar697877]

From: Steve
Date: 2007/08/01 Wed AM 11:14:26 EST
To: "Cowling, Kevin" <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: RE: Question about a hobby



Sir,

OK, so I assume that the playground areas/TOT lots are ok then, as they are either sand,
or wooden bark, NOT sod, correct? Or are the children guilty of the law as well when they
dig/play in them?

Also, does the park dept enforce this same rule against the various sports , i.
e. soccer, football, baseball ? Those and other activities also would pertain to that wording of the state law you are quoting. Thanks.

Mr. CODERRE

>
> From: "Cowling, Kevin" <[email protected]>
> Date: 2007/08/01 Wed AM 10:57:12 EST
> To: "Steve" <[email protected]>
> CC: "Elliott, Charles" <[email protected]>
> Subject: RE: Question about a hobby
>
> Mr. Corderre,
>
>
>
> I do appreciate you taking the time to email us in regards to your
> question about metal detecting in our parks. In regards to metal
> detecting rules that aren't posted on our website and the City Municode,
> the law actually comes from the State of Tennessee Annotated, it reads;
>
>
>
> Vandalism 39-14-408:
>
> "Any person who knowingly causes damage to or the destruction of
> personal property of another or of the State, the United States, any
> county, city or town knowing that the person does not have the owner's
> effective consent is guilty of an offense under this section."
>
>
>
> I do not doubt that you hold the highest standards in regard to your
> hobby, but we have had problems in the past of people digging and not
> repairing their holes throughout our parks. The result being the
> department not allowing this to continue. I again would like to thank
> you for taking the time to contact us and apologize for the delay in
> returning your email.
>
>
>
> Sincerely,
>
>
>
> Kevin Cowling, CPRP
>
> Deputy Director
>
> Clarksville Parks and Recreation
>
> 102 Public Square
>
> Clarksville, TN 37040
>
> Office - 931-645-7476
>
> Fax - 931-553-2432
>
> Cell - 931-320-1599
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Steve [mailto:[email protected]]
> Sent: Monday, July 16, 2007 5:37 PM
> To: Cowling, Kevin
> Subject: Question about a hobby
>
>
>
> Good Afternoon Sir,
>
>
>
> I understand from your secretary that I would have to ask you whether or
> not a hobby I am interested in pursuing is
>
> currently against any city of Clarksville Muni-code, or similar written
> law/regulation, being you are the Deputy Director.
>
>
>
> I am a hobby detectorist, and homeowner here in Clarksville, TN. I
> recently retired from the US Army and have
>
> decided to make this my home. I have reviewed your parks website, and
> also the muni-code of Clarksville.
>
>
>
> I have found only one park that specifically prohibits using a metal
> detector in the public park, that is the
>
> FT Defiance park. I definitely understand the reasoning behind that
> particular park, due to the vast historic
>
> value of it, and of course the fallen soldiers.
>
>
>
> No other park rules listed for any other park prohibit metal detector
> use, per your posted web site's for each park.
>
> Also, I find nothing in the city muni-code that would prohibit use on
> public city park land.
>
>
>
> Understand that we are not talking about shovels & backhoes here..just
> simple hobby detecting with a
>
> screwdriver size probe, etc. The hobby is actually very misunderstood by
> most, and I hope that by
>
> being a positive ambassador for the hobby detectorist in general , I
> could show what a great hobby this
>
> is. Have you ever lost anything of sentimental value in a park? People
> like me have found those sentimental
>
> things people have lost, and returned them when possible going to
> extremes to find the owners initials in rings, etc.
>
>
>
> It is all about a code of ethics. I myself, have a strong code of ethics
> & morals. I currently possess a Gov't Secret
>
> clearance, my fingerprints are on file with the local CPD (Just renewed
> my clearance-FBI fingerprint card), I have no record at all.
>
> So I can assure you that I would respect any park at all times if I were
> to detect in one.
>
>
>
> If the Park Dept or the local CPD ever need a reliable, experienced
> metal detectorist for any criminal issue, i.e.
>
> find robbery loot, dropped weapons, etc. I would help if asked.
> Currently there is no North TN Metal Detectorist
>
> Clubs that I am aware of, only the Middle TN club out of Nashville, TN.
> I might even one day wish to start a local
>
> north TN Club, and of course, I would demand the same code of ethics of
> its members.
>
>
>
> Thank you for your time.
>
>
>
>
> Steven G. Coderre
> Clarksville, TN
> (931) 378-2875

 

[soar697877]

This guy is not the sharpest knife in the drawer is he?

Ok, here is latest response from my city deputy park director:


From: Steve <[email protected]
Date: 2007/08/01 Wed PM 12:39:35 EST
To: "Cowling, Kevin" <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: RE: Question about a hobby



OK, first, my name is Mr. CODERRE, not Corderre.

Second, now you are deliberately being prejudiced against Metal Detectorists.

You are saying that it is ok for other Hobby users to dig and cause "vandalism"
in city parks because you "KNOW and expect" it, and agree to it for them, just not for metal detectorists, even in the TOT Lots, -sandy,wood/Bark areas?

You quoted an apparent state of TN law, but you are now choosing when to
enforce it...for the benefit of your wishes alone. The idea of that apparent state of TN law
you quoted was never intended for the hobbyists in mind, as the football, baseball,
football, Hobby Metal Detectorists, soccer players.

By the way, for your info...the properties in question are indeed PUBLIC
properties, not your personal land, and you cannot legally bend for some and not others if you are going to bend the laws you are quoting period. Have you ever actually read the
Clarksville Muni-code?

Here is an excerpt:

Sec. 10-236. Tampering with public property. - does not apply to MD'ing

or this one:

Sec. 12-503. Same--Function.

The recreation committee shall provide, conduct, and supervise public
playgrounds, athletic fields, recreation centers, and any other recreational
facilities and activities on properties that the city may own or private
property owners may provide or make available for such uses. The committee may
conduct any form of recreation or cultural activity that it deems advisable to
employ the leisure time of the people in a constructive and wholesome manner.
(Code 1963, § 20-3)



I believe my new Hobby is constructive and wholesome in manner, just as anyone
else's.




Maybe I should not have chosen Clarksville, TN to retire in, I thought
Clarksville had some
common sense, guess I was mistaken.



Steven CODERRE

Clarksville, TN


>
> From: "Cowling, Kevin" <[email protected]>
> Date: 2007/08/01 Wed AM 11:53:59 EST
> To: "Steve" <[email protected]>
> CC: "Elliott, Charles" <[email protected]>
> Subject: RE: RE: Question about a hobby
>
> Mr. Corderre,
>
> The children are not guilty of vandalism, as stated in the law it is
> says "without the owner's consent" it is known the playground will have
> this type of activity in the ground cover.
>
> The athletics are under the same premise, the city knows these teams
> will be using the facilities and any damage is the result of play, not a
> specific activity.
>
> Thank you,
>
> Kevin Cowling, CPRP
> Deputy Director
> Clarksville Parks and Recreation
> 102 Public Square
> Clarksville, TN 37040
> Office - 931-645-7476
> Fax - 931-553-2432
> Cell - 931-320-1599

 

[eagle77]

SOAR

IMHO, the intent of the law concerning vandalism must in fact prove an intent. (At least it does here). The term that they are attempting to apply is broad and at their whim. If this was me I'd pay him a visit and attempt to understand what the public park purpose is. Or go up the food chain and get an answer. But thats me, I get a little mule headed on occasion and the emails he sent you even made my blood ripple. Sounds like it is a blanket statement from an uninformed person.

Re-tek

Was this guy a park personnel or just a civilian? I'm slightly confused.



In general, the days of Terrorism are upon us whether we want to admit it or not. We are an forgetting society in general; we want to move on and not dwell on the past events.

20+ years ago, I did a paper on Terrorism in the USA. Hopefully we never see the times that are now taking place in Israel and other countries; armed military/police guards in school yards, checkpoints, etc. There is an inherit danger to life in general, but to go worrying that the sky may fall is not beneficial.


On an humorous side note Jeff...I get a package at work, they put it on my desk and I don't recall requesting it. I made my supervisor open it, since he accepted it . It wasn't anything that'd go BOOM, but he did get the idea not to be putting stuff on my desk. (I have everything organized and even a small boom would create such a problem in my organizational structure I wouldn't be able to find anything.)

 

[SC_hunter]

On an humorous side note Jeff...I get a package at work, they put it on my desk and I don't recall requesting it. I made my supervisor open it, since he accepted it . It wasn't anything that'd go BOOM, but he did get the idea not to be putting stuff on my desk. (I have everything organized and even a small boom would create such a problem in my organizational structure I wouldn't be able to find anything.)

I don't have a desk..but you could put it in my car...heck...it would have to go boom for me to find it...On the subject though..I think I would go face to face with the guy...it is much harder for a person to explain nonsense while looking you in the eye. Just my opinion.