Hammer quality Dovetail - opinions needed for seller

[moundbuilder]

Today, I sold my truck to a fella from Versailles, Indiana. Gave him a hell of a good price, too. Struck up a conversation w/him about artifacts and he said he had found a bunch on his property near Versailles, Indiana and I was welcome to walk his farm anytime. I said bring a few when you come get the truck, I'd like to see them. He obliged. First thing he showed me was an absolute no brainer 100% authentic 8" full groove archaic axe, weathered to death and plow scars but as real as the day is long. My heart started pumping a little bit. Second thing he showed me was a 3" Hornstone Adena blade, a little crude but still nice and definitely genuine. I know what I'm looking at and these were nice, collectible rocks. Third thing he unwrapped was this "Dovetail". He swore to God in front of his nephew that he found it on his farm, told me the story of how it was just sticking up, looked me in the eye and asked me how much it was worth. I held it for two seconds and my heart sank. I said "let me go get my hammer." He was dumbfounded and asked me what I meant... I held back and said "You found it, that's your story and you're sticking to it?" Again, he swore to it and reiterated the complete story of the day he found it, field conditions and everything. Then he asked me if I had any guns and I said hell yeah, I have a lot of guns. He said "I'll trade this for a nice gun." I told him I had a nice Daisy BB gun that needs oil and doesn't shoot straight but I'll trade. He kind of turned red and said "since you gave me a good deal on the truck I just might let you have the big "spear" as long as my wife doesn't mind." I asked if I could take a picture of the "spear" and ask some other folks what they thought since I had seen a ton just like them for sale in Friendship, Indiana. What do you guys think, should I take it for free or give him my old Red Ryder for his time?

 

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[The Grim Reaper]

Gray Ghost. Still valuble to some collectors, but definitely not an ancient artifact.

 

[joshuaream]

Clearly a grey ghost made from texas chert, but someone could have planted it in the field as a joke/prank. If he seems like an otherwise honest guy and not a collector, he might have actually found it and just not know.

I know of a case where a guy salted a couple of obvious bogus relics (a monolithic axe, a big obsidian clovis, etc.) as a joke a couple days before a planned hunt, only when they got there to hunt all they saw were foot prints. Someone beat them to the field and picked up the pieces and probably still swears he had the luckiest day ever. Another occasional poster here was the victim of someone salting his fields with more authentic looking hardstone fakes, he went from thinking he had found a spectacular cache to probably still doubting any future hardstone find he picks up in that field.

 

[Neanderthal]

As Joshua pointed out, the guy could be completely innocent. It happens all of the time. Just because someone found it doesn't mean it's real and because it's a modern reproduction doesn't mean they didn't honestly find it. "Seeding" is a common scenario.

 

[GaRebel1861]

I'd stay away from that point unless you collect fakes! It is clearly a fake to me. I agree that the person with it may not know that what he has is not old.

 

[The Grim Reaper]

Case in point, no pun intended. I found this Point in the early 80's in a field I hunted quite frequently. This field is located very close to a housing development with lots of kids playing in the area. When I found it I was really excited since it was the biggest piece of Flint I had ever found and I really wasn't all that knowledgable on types and lithics. As time went on and I became more educated on such things I began to question this piece because for one I haven't ever seen this basal style in any book and definitely nothing like it from southern Ohio, and two, the piece was very highly polished like it had been in water but was found no where near any water.

I finally took it to a few shows and was told by quite a few people what I already suspected and that was it was a repro. I figure some kid got it as a present or bought it at a gift shop and was playing with it in the field and lost it and then I came along and found it. I still keep it and display it in a small tray by itself and tell everyone the story if they ask.

So my point is, you can find repros in the fields whether they were put there on purpose by someone salting a field or by accident by what I assume happened in my case.

 

[moundbuilder]

Thanks for the comments. Obviously I knew it was modern but I have a feeling that he did, too. He told me he had recently turned down $800 for it but was willing to GIVE it to me. This was just after I told him the axe was worth $80-$100, which was an honest appraisal of it's value because it was weathered and beat up from the plow. I said I'd sure like the axe if he wanted to give that to me instead; after all, the "spear" was worth 10X more, right? He declined! This was just before his face turned red and he realized I was onto him. He had no interest in artifacts because he told me so. There was no way the axe was sentimental to him so I figure $100 made it more appealing for him to keep than something he knew was fake and worth only $50 or so.

 

[pointdlr]

Moundbuilder,

The guy was trying to rip you off. Glad he didn't get away with it. Everything about the story tells me that he knew exactly what he had. I hope you checked his funds before you gave him the title to the truck.

SRV,
Your point is odd, but I wouldn't rule it out. Looks like a serious patina on that hornstone. Have I ever held that one?

Jon.

 

[The Grim Reaper]

I'm not sure Jon. I have had it at the shows before and I even had the guy that was with Scott Yerkes look at it with his scope. He said it had deposits on it, but he said he could also see some copper marks on it. I've always though it was a an odd looking piece. I'll be sure to bring it to the show next year and let you take a closer look.

 

[Th3rty7]

Steve, looks like rechipped edgework and base on an authentic hornstone blade imo, from the pic anyway.

Oh, that dove, I wouldn't want anything to do with it.

 

[ohioaxeman]

Imagine walking up to that sucker in your favorite field. It would be sooooo hard to defend its authenticity, although YOU know it was laying right in front of you! AND.... if you tried to prove its authenticity, a million people would be in your spot before you could get back to it!