Has any one any info on the sloop General Gates? To the best of my researching abilities it sank of Colchester point in Lake Champlain
General Gates
- Thread starter whispers
- Start date
ivan salis
Gold Member
- Feb 5, 2007
- 16,794
- 3,810
- 🏆 Honorable Mentions:
- 1
- Detector(s) used
- delta 4000 / ace 250 - used BH and many others too
if your speaking about the vessel --HORATIO GATES --(named after major general horatio gates rev war hero) lost carrying CARRYING $50,000 IN GOLD, lost near malletts bay, vermont area (lake champlain) ?--if so heres the bad news **** those vessels are legally a no money "white elephant" due to the 1987 vermont law that claims all shipwrecks as "public property" --thus you can not make money off of it .(legally) ---
now the "good news" --- if looking for money try the missing St Albans bank funds robbed in 1864 there is about $128,000 worth of still unaccounted for funds stolen by rebel bank robbers who robbed 3 banks during daylight hours -- $ 208,000 was stolen of which $80,000 was recovered as the the town folk posse chased after the robbers who only got about a 20 min head start --the towns folk posse chased the robbers past enosburgh falls and into canada -- $ 128,000 of the money was not recovered--- a mixed bag of paper money , gold and silver cash.---some think the money or at the very least part of it might be buried along the escape path.
now the "good news" --- if looking for money try the missing St Albans bank funds robbed in 1864 there is about $128,000 worth of still unaccounted for funds stolen by rebel bank robbers who robbed 3 banks during daylight hours -- $ 208,000 was stolen of which $80,000 was recovered as the the town folk posse chased after the robbers who only got about a 20 min head start --the towns folk posse chased the robbers past enosburgh falls and into canada -- $ 128,000 of the money was not recovered--- a mixed bag of paper money , gold and silver cash.---some think the money or at the very least part of it might be buried along the escape path.
Galleon Hunter
Full Member
Here is some information I put together in my book...
1776. A British fleet, under the command of General Sir Guy Carleton and Captain Thomas Pringle, assembled on the northern shore of Lake Champlain. The British commanders had decided to invade the northern colonies, through the Champlain Valley, recapture Fort Ticonderoga and link up with General William Howe’s army near New York City. The plan would split New England from the rest of the colonies. Once the rebellious New England colonies were defeated; Britain could then defeat the rest of the colonies piecemeal. The British fleet sailed south on October 4. The fleet was comprised of the 180-ton corvette H.M.S. Inflexible, 18-guns; the schooner Maria, 12-guns; the schooner Carleton, 12-guns, the schooner Loyal Convert (a small vessel captured earlier) a radeau (a flat-bottomed, floating gun battery powered by sweeps) Thunderer, 14-guns (six 24-pounders, six 12-pounders and two howitzers.); twenty gunboats (each armed with one cannon); four long boats (each carrying a field gun); and twenty-four provision boats or batteaux. The fleet carried an invasion force of 13,000 soldiers including a thousand men from the 29th foot regiment serving as marines.
The Americans did not even have a fleet on Lake Champlain at the beginning of the war. A shipyard was built at Skenesboro (present-day Whitehall) and a fleet was hastily assembled. George Washington appointed Benedict Arnold as the naval commander on the lake. By August, the American squadron consisted of the schooner Royal Savage, 12-guns; the schooner Liberty, 8-guns; the sloop Enterprise, 12-guns, (all three vessels had been captured earlier); the schooner Revenge, 8-guns; four row galleys and eight or nine flat-bottomed gondolas, or gundalows, as they were commonly called. (The galleys included the Congress, 10-guns; the Gates, 8-guns, the Washington, 12-guns, commanded by General Waterbury and the Trumbull, 12-guns, Captain Seth Warner. The gondolas included the Providence, 3-guns; Philadelphia, 3-guns; Boston, 3-guns; New Haven, 3-guns; New York, 3-guns; Connecticut, 3-guns, Spitfire, 3-guns and the Jersey, 3-guns.)
Arnold anchored his ships behind Valcour Island, hoping to ambush the British squadron. On October 11, the Battle of Valcour Island began. During the exchange of cannonfire, the Revenge sustained heavy damage. The Royal Savage, under the command of Captain David Hawley, ran aground and was set on fire by the crew to prevent the ship from falling into enemy hands. The Congress and Washington were also heavily damaged as were the New York and Jersey. Around 6:30 P.M. a cannon ball fired from the Inflexible sank the Philadelphia. The British casualties also began to mount as Carleton tried to land a boarding party on the grounded Royal Savage, but were forced to withdraw under heavy fire. One small gunboat, commanded by Lieutenant Dufais, suffered a direct hit and sank, two others were so heavily damaged that they were scuttled.
Arnold’s squadron had suffered considerable damage from the encounter. As dusk fell, the British broke off the fight and anchored for the night across the channel. They would wait until morning to destroy the remainder of the American fleet. Aware that he could not defeat the superior force, the American commander decided to retreat to Crown Point, at the southern end of the lake where American shore batteries could provide protective cover. With muffled oars, the American slipped past the moored enemy vessels unnoticed. At daybreak, the British were furious to discover that the Americans had escaped, but to wind was now in their favor and they quickly hoisted anchor and gave chase. A four-day running gun battle ensued and one by one, various American vessels were captured or destroyed.
The Providence was driven ashore in the shallow water of Buttonmould Bay off Schuyler Island (about ten miles north of Crown Point) on October 12, where the larger British ships could not follow. The vessel was then stripped of guns, powder and anything else of use and set on fire. The New Haven and Boston both made it to Arnold’s Bay, where they were destroyed to prevent their falling into British hands on October 13. The Spitfire was also burned on October 13. The Congress was burned near Crown Point on October 15.
Out of the sixteen American vessels, only the Trumbull, Enterprise, Revenge, Liberty and New York reached Crown Point. There Arnold was forced to withdraw his 200 men to the safety of Fort Ticonderoga. American losses were listed as over eighty killed, (including twenty-seven from the Congress) or wounded and 120 men captured. The British casualties were much lower.
By that time, snow was already falling and the British commander, Sir Guy Carleton had no alternative, but to withdraw his own forces, return to Canada and make camp for the winter. Naval historian Alfred Thayer Mahan acknowledged the sacrifice made at the Battle of Valcour Bay. “The little American Navy was wiped out, but never had any force, big or small, lived to a better purpose or died more gloriously.” The following year, a better-prepared American army under the command of General Horatio Gates would defeat the British army under the command of General John Burgoyne at the Battle of Saratoga. Saratoga would mark a turning point in the American Revolution and France soon entered the war on the side of the Americans.
The gunboat Philadelphia was raised from the depth of Lake Champlain by Lorenzo Hagglund in 1935. In addition to the guns and hull, hundreds of other items were recovered from the vessel. These relics included shot, cooking utensils, tools, buttons, buckles and human bones. In 1961, the gunboat was donated to the Smithsonian Institution in where it was placed on permanent exhibit.
In 1997, a remote sensing survey conducted the Lake Champlain Maritime Museum discovered an intact gondola, sitting upright on the bottom of Lake Champlain. The shipwreck was in pristine condition, with her masts still standing and her bow gun still in place. The lake’s cold, dark fresh water contributed to her remarkable state of preservation. The amazing find was termed the “missing gunboat” as historians and researchers were unsure as to which of the eight gunboats it was. Through the process of elimination, they soon determined that the vessel had to be either the Connecticut or Spitfire.
In 1999, a new document surfaced which confirmed all the previous research and positively identified the “missing gunboat” as the Spitfire. The extraordinary manuscript entitled “A Return of the fleet belonging to the United States of America on Lake Champlain under the Command of Brigadier General Arnold” is dated October 22, 1776. The document lists each vessel by name, each vessel’s commander and ordnance and concludes with a column “The Fate of the Fleet.” (Note: Much confussion still surrounds the actual event. Several authors identify the Congress and not the Providence as the vessel driven ashore at Buttonmould Bay. Other accounts claim the Boston was sunk during the action on October 12. Both the Jersey and Washington seem to have been captured. The Connecticut appears to have survived the battle. Some accounts of the battle also mention the cutter Lee, 8-guns, 48-tons, as being part of the American fleet. Other sources indicate the Lee was captured by the British shortly after the Battle of Valcour Island and incorporated into their flotilla.) (10,25,27,31,60,122,257,438,470,474,488,500,529)
1777. Several American vessels that had survived the Battle of Valcour Island were destroyed by the patriots to prevent being captured when the British fleet on Lake Champlain was reinforced the following summer. These vessels included the schooner Liberty, (called a ketch in some accounts) 8-guns, 40-tons; the row galley Gates, 12-guns, 123-tons, the row galley Trumbull, 12-guns, 123-tons; and the small schooner Revenge, 8-guns, 50-tons. Pieces of the wreck of the Trumbull were recovered and displayed for a while at Fort Ticonderoga in 1954. (Note: The Liberty was originally named the Katharine. She was built as a yacht for Philip Skene, a wealthy gentleman that lived at the southern end of Lake Champlain. In May 1775, a group of New England patriots seized the vessel and armed her with eight small cannons. A few days later, Ethan Allen and his Green Mountain Boys captured Fort Ticonderoga. On May 18, 1775, the Liberty raided St. John’s, at the northern tip of the lake and Benedict Arnold was able to capture (without a fight) the sloop George (renamed Enterprise) and the schooner Royal Savage and add them to his squadron. The Liberty did not participate in the Battle of Valcour Island.) (10,25,27,31,49,60,122,257,438,470,474,488,500,529)
1777. Two American schooners were lost on Lake Champlain. The Trumbull, carrying $56,000 in coins, sank on St. Michael’s Reef; and the General Gates crashed on a reef off Colchester Point during a storm, sending $45,000 in silver coins to the bottom. (Note: Although the source does not give a date, these are probably references to the row galleys Trumbull and Gates noted above. Although I have been unable to find any documents to substantiate the claim that these vessels were carrying any treasure, according to the story local fishermen have reported seeing some of these coins scattered on St. Michael’s Reef.) (380)
Good Luck,
GH
1776. A British fleet, under the command of General Sir Guy Carleton and Captain Thomas Pringle, assembled on the northern shore of Lake Champlain. The British commanders had decided to invade the northern colonies, through the Champlain Valley, recapture Fort Ticonderoga and link up with General William Howe’s army near New York City. The plan would split New England from the rest of the colonies. Once the rebellious New England colonies were defeated; Britain could then defeat the rest of the colonies piecemeal. The British fleet sailed south on October 4. The fleet was comprised of the 180-ton corvette H.M.S. Inflexible, 18-guns; the schooner Maria, 12-guns; the schooner Carleton, 12-guns, the schooner Loyal Convert (a small vessel captured earlier) a radeau (a flat-bottomed, floating gun battery powered by sweeps) Thunderer, 14-guns (six 24-pounders, six 12-pounders and two howitzers.); twenty gunboats (each armed with one cannon); four long boats (each carrying a field gun); and twenty-four provision boats or batteaux. The fleet carried an invasion force of 13,000 soldiers including a thousand men from the 29th foot regiment serving as marines.
The Americans did not even have a fleet on Lake Champlain at the beginning of the war. A shipyard was built at Skenesboro (present-day Whitehall) and a fleet was hastily assembled. George Washington appointed Benedict Arnold as the naval commander on the lake. By August, the American squadron consisted of the schooner Royal Savage, 12-guns; the schooner Liberty, 8-guns; the sloop Enterprise, 12-guns, (all three vessels had been captured earlier); the schooner Revenge, 8-guns; four row galleys and eight or nine flat-bottomed gondolas, or gundalows, as they were commonly called. (The galleys included the Congress, 10-guns; the Gates, 8-guns, the Washington, 12-guns, commanded by General Waterbury and the Trumbull, 12-guns, Captain Seth Warner. The gondolas included the Providence, 3-guns; Philadelphia, 3-guns; Boston, 3-guns; New Haven, 3-guns; New York, 3-guns; Connecticut, 3-guns, Spitfire, 3-guns and the Jersey, 3-guns.)
Arnold anchored his ships behind Valcour Island, hoping to ambush the British squadron. On October 11, the Battle of Valcour Island began. During the exchange of cannonfire, the Revenge sustained heavy damage. The Royal Savage, under the command of Captain David Hawley, ran aground and was set on fire by the crew to prevent the ship from falling into enemy hands. The Congress and Washington were also heavily damaged as were the New York and Jersey. Around 6:30 P.M. a cannon ball fired from the Inflexible sank the Philadelphia. The British casualties also began to mount as Carleton tried to land a boarding party on the grounded Royal Savage, but were forced to withdraw under heavy fire. One small gunboat, commanded by Lieutenant Dufais, suffered a direct hit and sank, two others were so heavily damaged that they were scuttled.
Arnold’s squadron had suffered considerable damage from the encounter. As dusk fell, the British broke off the fight and anchored for the night across the channel. They would wait until morning to destroy the remainder of the American fleet. Aware that he could not defeat the superior force, the American commander decided to retreat to Crown Point, at the southern end of the lake where American shore batteries could provide protective cover. With muffled oars, the American slipped past the moored enemy vessels unnoticed. At daybreak, the British were furious to discover that the Americans had escaped, but to wind was now in their favor and they quickly hoisted anchor and gave chase. A four-day running gun battle ensued and one by one, various American vessels were captured or destroyed.
The Providence was driven ashore in the shallow water of Buttonmould Bay off Schuyler Island (about ten miles north of Crown Point) on October 12, where the larger British ships could not follow. The vessel was then stripped of guns, powder and anything else of use and set on fire. The New Haven and Boston both made it to Arnold’s Bay, where they were destroyed to prevent their falling into British hands on October 13. The Spitfire was also burned on October 13. The Congress was burned near Crown Point on October 15.
Out of the sixteen American vessels, only the Trumbull, Enterprise, Revenge, Liberty and New York reached Crown Point. There Arnold was forced to withdraw his 200 men to the safety of Fort Ticonderoga. American losses were listed as over eighty killed, (including twenty-seven from the Congress) or wounded and 120 men captured. The British casualties were much lower.
By that time, snow was already falling and the British commander, Sir Guy Carleton had no alternative, but to withdraw his own forces, return to Canada and make camp for the winter. Naval historian Alfred Thayer Mahan acknowledged the sacrifice made at the Battle of Valcour Bay. “The little American Navy was wiped out, but never had any force, big or small, lived to a better purpose or died more gloriously.” The following year, a better-prepared American army under the command of General Horatio Gates would defeat the British army under the command of General John Burgoyne at the Battle of Saratoga. Saratoga would mark a turning point in the American Revolution and France soon entered the war on the side of the Americans.
The gunboat Philadelphia was raised from the depth of Lake Champlain by Lorenzo Hagglund in 1935. In addition to the guns and hull, hundreds of other items were recovered from the vessel. These relics included shot, cooking utensils, tools, buttons, buckles and human bones. In 1961, the gunboat was donated to the Smithsonian Institution in where it was placed on permanent exhibit.
In 1997, a remote sensing survey conducted the Lake Champlain Maritime Museum discovered an intact gondola, sitting upright on the bottom of Lake Champlain. The shipwreck was in pristine condition, with her masts still standing and her bow gun still in place. The lake’s cold, dark fresh water contributed to her remarkable state of preservation. The amazing find was termed the “missing gunboat” as historians and researchers were unsure as to which of the eight gunboats it was. Through the process of elimination, they soon determined that the vessel had to be either the Connecticut or Spitfire.
In 1999, a new document surfaced which confirmed all the previous research and positively identified the “missing gunboat” as the Spitfire. The extraordinary manuscript entitled “A Return of the fleet belonging to the United States of America on Lake Champlain under the Command of Brigadier General Arnold” is dated October 22, 1776. The document lists each vessel by name, each vessel’s commander and ordnance and concludes with a column “The Fate of the Fleet.” (Note: Much confussion still surrounds the actual event. Several authors identify the Congress and not the Providence as the vessel driven ashore at Buttonmould Bay. Other accounts claim the Boston was sunk during the action on October 12. Both the Jersey and Washington seem to have been captured. The Connecticut appears to have survived the battle. Some accounts of the battle also mention the cutter Lee, 8-guns, 48-tons, as being part of the American fleet. Other sources indicate the Lee was captured by the British shortly after the Battle of Valcour Island and incorporated into their flotilla.) (10,25,27,31,60,122,257,438,470,474,488,500,529)
1777. Several American vessels that had survived the Battle of Valcour Island were destroyed by the patriots to prevent being captured when the British fleet on Lake Champlain was reinforced the following summer. These vessels included the schooner Liberty, (called a ketch in some accounts) 8-guns, 40-tons; the row galley Gates, 12-guns, 123-tons, the row galley Trumbull, 12-guns, 123-tons; and the small schooner Revenge, 8-guns, 50-tons. Pieces of the wreck of the Trumbull were recovered and displayed for a while at Fort Ticonderoga in 1954. (Note: The Liberty was originally named the Katharine. She was built as a yacht for Philip Skene, a wealthy gentleman that lived at the southern end of Lake Champlain. In May 1775, a group of New England patriots seized the vessel and armed her with eight small cannons. A few days later, Ethan Allen and his Green Mountain Boys captured Fort Ticonderoga. On May 18, 1775, the Liberty raided St. John’s, at the northern tip of the lake and Benedict Arnold was able to capture (without a fight) the sloop George (renamed Enterprise) and the schooner Royal Savage and add them to his squadron. The Liberty did not participate in the Battle of Valcour Island.) (10,25,27,31,49,60,122,257,438,470,474,488,500,529)
1777. Two American schooners were lost on Lake Champlain. The Trumbull, carrying $56,000 in coins, sank on St. Michael’s Reef; and the General Gates crashed on a reef off Colchester Point during a storm, sending $45,000 in silver coins to the bottom. (Note: Although the source does not give a date, these are probably references to the row galleys Trumbull and Gates noted above. Although I have been unable to find any documents to substantiate the claim that these vessels were carrying any treasure, according to the story local fishermen have reported seeing some of these coins scattered on St. Michael’s Reef.) (380)
Good Luck,
GH
Top Member Reactions
-
3444 -
1972 -
1907 -
1135 -
1084 -
1002 -
875 -
866 -
859 -
774 -
758 -
676 -
653 -
567 -
504 -
452 -
446 -
412 -
403 -
E
397
