Cap and ball revolver and rifle action I.D.

[theloadroom]

Greetings fellow seekers! I sure love the gun mysteries I've been turning up!
Cap and ball revolver found in a creek bottom near Horseshoe Bend, ID. Would like to know the approximate year, make, model. the bore and one chamber I can barely reach mic. approximately .31 cal, 2" barrel may be cut down but retains a front sight, no trigger, gaurd or loading lever/ball starter left, 3 of the five chambers are still loaded with what look to be conical bullets, to much rust and pitting to get any identifiable markings.

The rifle action was found near Yuma AZ in the desert, appears to be a slide action 22 cal. but does not match the Savage actions I have reviewed, sn legible 3527* no other stampings or markings, maybe a house brand? Thanks all.

 

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[baspinall]

You revolver looks like one of those Spanish colt remakes to me.

Brian

 

[theloadroom]

You revolver looks like one of those Spanish colt remakes to me.

Brian

Thanks for the opinion Brian :P

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

The pistol does not appear to be a Colt as even "chopped" there would still be a barrel wedge going in from the left side (where the screw is).

The rifle frame is an internal hammer & slide safety - narrowing it down considerably. Doesn't ring any bells with me, though.

 

[kuger]

The revolver looks like a Rem. to me.Gamblers were known to saw the barrels off to conceal them,I have several pics around here of them,when I find them I will post them!

 

[Montana Jim]

Intresting reading here: http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=25503

"During the second half of the 19th century many people carried cap&ball or cap-to-cartridge revolvers with amputated barrels. Sometimes the front sight was restored, and sometimes not. If you have a Colt-pattern gun in mind you can modify an extra barrel and have it both ways. The best way for modern shooters to reload the cylinder is to remove it from the gun and use a bench tool that is available from Dixie Gun Works in Union City, TN. You can also reassemble the original loading lever assembly, load the cylinder, and then remove the lever prior to shooting the gun. They are fun too shoot, but you will get some unburnt powder out of the muzzle because of it short length. On the range be careful of a possible fire hazard."

 

[theloadroom]

Thanks Charlie P. (NY) I agree with the "no barrel wedge" thought, "The rifle frame is an internal hammer & slide safety"
I had found the similar actions in that configuration but the frames were a little different, thank you though.

Thanks kuger I believed that also but a local yocal thought otherwise

Thank you Montana Jim, I have a couple of C&B arms but no revolvers

 

[DanB]

By looking at the rifle receiver, you can see the safety switch is on top of the rear of the receiver.....mossberg semi auto rifles has the thumb safety on the upper rear of the receiver.....just about all others have a trigger finger safety..... safe bet would be a semi auto mossberg rifle, probably used in a crime, somebody probably cut it up in small pieces and pitched them in different locations through out the desert.........find any other parts

that old pistol looks like it still has rounds still in the cylinders.....be careful it maybe old but still could be dangerous.....
good pictures,nice finds and HH

db

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Here are gun schematics if someone has time and/or patience to search. Click Start Here. http://www.e-gunparts.com/aboutschematics.asp http://www.e-gunparts.com/aboutschematics.asp

 

[theloadroom]

Thank you for the input DanB, no other parts. I'll keep the Mossberg in mind for research, Agreed on "still could be dangerous" for the revolver but deterioration has locked all parts together so prevents recapping the nipples and all other functions, fire would be the only real danger at this point. HH

Thanks bigcypresshunter Gun Parts Corp on line wants money for pdf schematics so I'll have to use my catalogs, I do occasionally use that company along with Dixie Gun works for info, I do appreciate the help!

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Thank you for the input DanB, no other parts. I'll keep the Mossberg in mind for research, Agreed on "still could be dangerous" for the revolver but deterioration has locked all parts together so prevents recapping the nipples and all other functions, fire would be the only real danger at this point. HH

Thanks bigcypresshunter Gun Parts Corp on line wants money for pdf schematics so I'll have to use my catalogs, I do occasionally use that company along with Dixie Gun works for info, I do appreciate the help!

My link shows the schematics for free, but they are small. For free on-line viewable schematics click on "START HERE". I searched most all the Mossbergs and could not find the match.
As far as the possibly dangerous blackpowder, I would think that immersing it in water would help wash out any remaining powder and render it harmless. Try to poke a wire in the nipple to get the powder wet. Maybe electrolysis can help dissassemble it but black powder is highly corrosive all those years and I realize the nipples are frozen. The whole cylinder is frozen Im sure. I guess its possible the powder is still dry inside and dangerous.

 

[theloadroom]

Thank you BCH! I also found the free section but hard to see lol, no matches yet for either so this may take awhile Thanks guys

 

[Montana Jim]

Thanks Charlie P. (NY) I agree with the "no barrel wedge" thought, "The rifle frame is an internal hammer & slide safety"
I had found the similar actions in that configuration but the frames were a little different, thank you though.

Thanks kuger I believed that also but a local yocal thought otherwise

Thank you Montana Jim, I have a couple of C&B arms but no revolvers

I thought that is what you were asking about in yout original post? The c&b revolver you pictured?

 

[theloadroom]

Thanks Charlie P. (NY) I agree with the "no barrel wedge" thought, "The rifle frame is an internal hammer & slide safety"
I had found the similar actions in that configuration but the frames were a little different, thank you though.

Thanks kuger I believed that also but a local yocal thought otherwise

Thank you Montana Jim, I have a couple of C&B arms but no revolvers

I thought that is what you were asking about in yout original post? The c&b revolver you pictured?

The C&B revolver in the original posting is the only one I now own or have ever owned, am I missing something

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

With the sawed off barrel the loading lever is also missing. I see the link from Jim on how to load but I wonder how the old timers did it?

Neither one of these guns have been identified as yet. Where are our gun people, out detecting?

 

[theloadroom]

With the sawed off barrel the loading lever is also missing. I see the link from Jim on how to load but I wonder how the old timers did it?

Neither one of these guns have been identified as yet. Where are our gun people, out detecting?

Lucky buggers, can't blame them though winter has finally broken in a few areas! A gun forum site I posted to still has no positive I.D. yet on either one :P

 

[kuger]

well,I cant find an exact match to your pistol in any of my books,but I did find the pictures I was talking about.

 

[theloadroom]

Thanks kuger!

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

With the sawed off barrel the loading lever is also missing. I see the link from Jim on how to load but I wonder how the old timers did it?

Neither one of these guns have been identified as yet. Where are our gun people, out detecting?

The little ones you can load with a dowel or the cylinder pin.

Hard to identify a rifle from a piece or two!! That's just the lower receiver. It's like identifying a car from the frame only. I have an older copy of the Numrich printed catalog (same as the e-gunparts) with hundreds of the exploded views and nothing looks similar - even among the Mossbergs. No hits in my 1950 Stoeger Catalog, either. The coil spring on the hammer puts it in the 1900's to present. Not much help there. The Marlin take-down M39 has the same rounded feature on the front of the lower receiver, but that's a lever action w/exposed hammer. There are about twenty .22 LR take-down rifles that have the screw-hole for the take-down bolt where that one has one. Again, no help there.

 

[theloadroom]

Thank you Charlie P. (NY), at least we now know what it isn't ! LOL