Cannon Ball ID

[Joker-T]

Hello

Can anyone ID this as being an actual CW cannon ball and if so is it north or south? Any assistance would be great.

It measure 5 1/2" and weighs 16 lbs 5 1/2 oz. It also has what looks like a fuse hole. It was reportedly dug in PA.

Steve

 

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[Bryanhashemi]

Im Worried about the mold line. Kuger or cannonballguy will help better. But I'm not sure it's a cannonball

 

[HutSiteDigger]

Lets wake CannonBallGuy up.. I got an answer for you but CBG can give you way better details than what I will type! Im sure he will answer this very soon!

 

[Bryanhashemi]

Maybe a colonial one? Some had mold lines. Probably a rock crushing ball. Any mining around where you are?

 

[DoranHashemi]

Civil war cannonballs had mold lines but very faint. The mold line is very visual. Any numbers on it?

 

[TheCannonballGuy]

I'm sure it is a cannonball. Its diameter and weight prove it is what is called a 24-pounder caliber shell. The only uncertainty about it is when it was made and who made it.

The 24-pounder round explosive shells have been in existence since the early Colonial era, through the civil war. So this one could theoretically be American colonial, British colonial, civil war yankee, or civil war Confederate. I'll need very precise measurement of that ball's diameter to be able to tell you whether it is Colonial or civil war era. I'll also need to know whether its fuzehole is 7/8" diamter or 1"-diameter or 1.25"-diameter (at is top).

The statement that it came from Pennsylvania doesn't automatically mean it was dug in Pennsylvania. But just for the sake of discussion, let's say it was dug in PA. The only time during the civil war that the Confederates had 24-pounder shells in PA was at the battle of Gettysburg, and most of the ones they used there had a metal fuze (which was screwed into the fuzehole). Is there threading in your shell's fuzehole? I'm asking because although no threading shows in the photo, you might be able to see something we cannot.

Until I get the needed information from you (very-exact diameter, fuzehole-top's diameter, and threading question), I'd have to say the statistical odds favor it being a Revolutionary War or War-of-1812 shell, or a Confederate one which was dug somewhere south of Pennsylvania but wound up there in "recent" years.

 

[tennessee digger]

ThecannonballGuy is pretty sharp on this stuff, once again I'm GLAD he is on this forum! He is a real wealth of information and we all appreciate his sharing his knowledge. Thanks Pete. Tennessee digger

 

[Joker-T]

Thanks much, that was a wealth. The only other cannon ball I have with a seem like that is Rev War era and it's encrusted from being in the water. I will get you the info soonest.

Steve

 

[Joker-T]

Hi again

Here are the specs, the ball diameter is 17 1/2" the fuse hole is 7/8" I can see and feel what appears to be very fine threads.

Steve

 

[TheCannonballGuy]

Hmm... those three pieces of information are in conflict, if the hollow cast-iron ball is really a cannonball, which I believe it is. The fuzehole on a US 24-pounder Coehorn Mortar roundshell is 7/8"-diameter at its top. But no civil war or earlier 24-pounder roundshell had "very fine" threading in its fuzehole. The threading was 12-threads-per-inch. That is not considered "very-fine gauge" threading. If there's any way uou can do so, please shoot (and post) several well-focused closeup photos of the threading you see in the fuzehole.

The circumference measurement report of 17.5-inches (5.57"-diameter) is also bad news. A civil war 24-pounder caliber cannonball (or mortar ball) was specificed by the Ordnance Department to be 5.68"-diameter. Colonial-era ones were a bit smaller, approximately 5.65"-diameter or a bit less. Did you use a cloth measuring-tape, or a real Diameter-Tape, or did you use some other method for the measuring?

 

[Joker-T]

We used a string we don't have a cloth measuring tape. The Threads are very corroded at closer inspection I can't tell if they are threads or not, they sort of look like it but no sure. I will try to get better pics, the guy I'm thinking about buying it from still has it. When measured across the ball again we come up with 5 5/8". At this point I may pass on it unless you tell me it's a real connaon ball even if it is not CW era, I would still do the deal if it's older.

Steve

 

[TheCannonballGuy]

It can be quite difficult to accurately measure a ball which is too large for a caliper to work on. I myself have trouble getting a professional-quality Diameter Tape to stay on a big ball's "equator" when trying to measute the ball's diameter. The tape keeps trying to slip down off the equator, and when that happens you get a smaller measurement result.

You say this ball's diameter measure 5-&-5/8-inches in your second try at measuring it. That fraction equals 5.62-inches, which is just a couple of hundredths-of-an-inch less than the correct diameter for a 24-pounder caliber RevWar/War-Of-1812 cannonball.

You wrote:
< At this point I may pass on it unless you tell me it's a real cannon ball
> even if it is not CW era, I would still do the deal if it's older.

Fakes and Reproductions of hollow (explosive type) shells almost never weigh "right-at" what they should weigh if they were genuine. This one is within a few ounces of the Ordnance Manual's specified weight. That, and the "shellwall thickness," is why I was pretty sure in my first reply that this is a real one. I asked for additional information because I wanted to be able to tell you its time-period, anf its maker (US, CS, British, etc). The result of your second diameter-measurement indicates it is RevWar/War-Of-1812. Perhaps someday you'll be able to check its diameter with a proper wide-jaw caliper (which is shaped like a letter C with a hinge in the middle), and get a truly super-accurate measurement. If the diameter turns out to be more like 5.68" than 5.62" it is a civil war one.

Because the weight and diameter are in the correct range, I suspect it doesn't actually have fine threading in the fuzehole. Closeup photos will settle that concern. It might be a real one whch was an unused "leftover" from the war, and wound up being mounted on a monument by screwing a threaded tod into the fuzehole. I know of many other cannonshells that that got done to, in Pennsylvania, where this one is said to be from.

 

[debi712]

Today I was working in the yard, clearing some small rocks out of an area by some trees and heard clunk, dug deeper to get the rock out, much to my surprise I found this. I have NO clue what it is, cannonball? Anyone help me? I live in Idaho, not an area for civil war or revolutionary relics? help ! A magnet does attach itself to it when put near it. It weighs maybe 5-6 pounds? Added some more pics after I rinsed in warm water.

 

[TheCannonballGuy]

To diagnose with certainty whether it is a cannonball or not, we need extremely precise measurement of the ball's diameter (a ruler won't do), and extremely precise weight measurement in pounds AND ounces (use a Postal Shipping scale, because bathroom-scales are inaccurate, and don't weigh in ounces).

By the way, since I see it's your very first post... welcome to TreasureNet and its What-Is-It forum, the very best place on the internet to get mystery-objects identified by real experts.

 

[Joker-T]

Thanks much.

Steve

 

[debi712]

8 5/8 " circumference 2 pound and little over 12 oz. I used a piece of tape to measure, and used a postal scale to weigh. I live in Idaho, the house we live in was built in the 70's, before then there was nothing here, just land. I do not know if the black holes are fuse holes, dirt or what.

 

[TheCannonballGuy]

Thank you for providing the very-precise weight and size measurements. They prove the ball is not a cannonball or grapeshot-ball, etc.

The proof:
There are literally multi-millions of iron/steel balls in existence which were NOT manufactured for use in cannons. Examples are ball-bearings, ore-crusher balls from the Mining & Stonemilling industry, Ornamental-Ironwork balls (such as a gatepost-top), Sports Shot Put balls, etc. Fortunately for us cannonball collectors, we have historical records which tell us the very-exact diameter and very-exact weight of every version of artillery balls that got used in America from the Colonial era through the end of the civil war. That data is given in the US (and CSA) Ordnance Manual, in size-charts called the "Shot Tables." www.civilwarartillery.com/shottables.htm

You say your ball weighs a little over 2 pounds 12 ounces. That is equivalent to 2.8 pounds. There is no 2.8-pound ball in the Shot Tables -- which means it is not an artillery ball.

Additional info, regarding what I believe your ball most probably is:
You say your ball's circumference is 8-&-5/8-inches. That translates to 2.74-inches in diameter. Because it has a thin coating of rust-concretion on it, its metal body is slightly smaller -- let's say, 2.65-inches or perhaps a teeny bit more. The "Shot Tables" say a 2.63-inch CAST-IRON ball weighs 2.4 pounds (approximately 2 lb. 6.5 ounces). Your ball is only a few hundredths-of-an-inch larger, but it weighs about 6 ounces more than the cast-iron ball. So, your ball cannot be cast-iron. It has to be steel, which is a heavier metal than simple cast-iron. No artillery balls made of steel were used in America. So, you steel ball is most probably either an ore-crusher ball or a large ball-bearing.

 

[AU Seeker]

Idaho has a long mining history so I would think it's a ball from a ballmill, it's about the size of medium balls for a large ballmill.

As TCBG stated is also could be a ball bearing, but I think it's rather large for most ball bearing used in mining machinery.

 

[debi712]

I thank you for your time & appreciate your help. It stumped me living in Idaho Falls, how it could possibly be a cannon ball. But the 3 black spots did not know if they were holes filled with decay, dirt or what else. I moved here from Georgia 5 years ago and do not know the surrounding history of Idaho. Snake River is not too far away from here, and I think there was a battle at Taylors crossing, but that is it. I know of no ore mining in this area in the past, so that leaves a big machine that may have been in the area before this house was built in the 70's which was just land. Idaho is mostly desert soil and extremely rocky. Any more ideas would be appreciated. This was my first 'find' , lol and I was going to call the police to defuse the cannonball .

 

[debi712]

Thank you AU seeker, can you explain ballmills in layman's (errr, old lady terms?) If you and TCBG will google Idaho Falls and note we are in a valley here, do you still think is possible for mining to have been done here at one time? Any help would be appreciated for this ball of rusted steel.....