Calling anyone interest in solving a cipher?

[Crow]

Hello All

Old Crow has below zero cryptography skills.

I have a document all I know its mid 17th century. written in old english. Every one opinions are welcome.

Have fun.....



Crow

 

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[robertk]

I'd have to work at it just to figure out the script at the top that isn't in code.

 

[Red-Coat]

Interesting document.

From a combination of Optical Character Recognition and Google translate, I get this for the top section of script:

From the same book Ms. De forms Bis [This?] Table no3 Standards Son Undornets Surveys bem nóo are dερους touk of Surrackers to write im Bat Manor Hor ang man Ball Trade; but by The Table-feloving [following?]

OCR doesn’t always get it right of course, but maybe that’s a starting point for determining it to be some kind of table of standards for something.

 

[Red-Coat]

The bottom section looks to be some kind of variation on 'Pigpen' cipher, used by Freemasons and others for secure correspondence. The standard alphabet was replaced by symbols on a letter-by-letter basis, like this:

That was the standard letter substitution (which doesn't match your text) but there were many variations using similar types of symbols.

 

[Blackfoot58]

The bottom section looks to be some kind of variation on 'Pigpen' cipher, used by Freemasons and others for secure correspondence. The standard alphabet was replaced by symbols on a letter-by-letter basis, like this:

View attachment 2180321

That was the standard letter substitution (which doesn't match your text) but there were many variations using similar types of symbols.

I agree. I get the following:
ED VAHDE OPEN Y UP NN HCL
I have no explanation of meaning; just a rough translation.
EDVAHDE could be Edward/Edwardo/Eduardo etc.

The key I learned from was very similar to Red-Coat’s but had a few changes in the order. Also, there appear to be some semicolons in the OP. I have no idea as to their possible affect.

 

[tamrock]

Looks like a single page of a note book. What do the other pages have written on them.?

 

[Blackfoot58]

Ok. I missed a glaring hint.
The center grid on the OP document is the key to what’s written at the bottom. 3 characters per cell = 3 character choices per cell.
The first character would represent “c” as it has no single, or double dot above it.
I do not understand all of the characters from the grid key. Some are possibly archaic. I also do not understand what appears to be T, with and without a dot, in the message.
This grid style is typical of a layout for a key of such a cipher.

 

[Red-Coat]

I agree. I get the following:
ED VAHDE OPEN Y UP NN HCL
I have no explanation of meaning; just a rough translation.
EDVAHDE could be Edward/Edwardo/Eduardo etc.

The key I learned from was very similar to Red-Coat’s but had a few changes in the order. Also, there appear to be some semicolons in the OP. I have no idea as to their possible affect.

'Eduardo' could be interesting. Some of the strange words generated by OCR were recognised as having a possible Portuguese origin.

 

[malenkai]

Pigpen is a simple substitution cipher; you don't need to know the mappings to break it, any alphabet will do. Transliterating the bottom part, respecting the diacritical marks, gives us cipher text of (check my math of course)

abcdeb; afghd cijkkejl

Running it thru an online English-based substitution cipher breaker gives us

naresa; ndthe rwillsig

Obviously, if the source language is Portuguese or something else, you need a different source alphabet cipher breaker, but you get the idea. I'm sure there are online breakers for most languages. I'm not sure if there is enough source cipher text to break it thru frequency analysis or if it is even a substitution cipher in the first place, but it could be.

As for one poster's suggestion that the middle box is the key -- it is unclear to me what that assertion is based on.

 

[Mackaydon]

Take the first letter in each cell. They are in alpha order. The second letter in each cell and the third letter are also in alpha order.
Don in So Cal.
PS: Note also that "I" and "J" are missing . In the last cell, the "S " is correct but the next symbol appears to be the 'missing' "W" ; out of sequence.

 

[Mackaydon]

Crow,
Can you post the pages immediately before and after this one?
Don in SoCal

 

[Blackfoot58]

The key for such a cipher is often shown in a similar (hashtag) grid. Each cell had a specific shape. The shape then denotes a letter or a choice of letters. There are literally thousands of possible variations, although most are different in a very similar way: a character with a dot above it, a character with an x below it, a character that is circled, ad nauseum. For instance: the center cell of the key (hashtag) is a square.
The square now takes on a meaning; let’s say E. Now put a dot in the middle of the square: that equals R.
Anything is readable if you have the key. Let’s say a square with 2 dots equals the number 7.
You can now write err 7, with squares and dots.