Bullet Shell Casing I.D.

[OutBack Duo]

I found this in an area where there was a Civil War battle/skirmish in North West Missouri. It is 3.6cm long and 1.4cm wide just above the base. The base itself is about 1.5 or 1.6cm. The item is brass with no markings.

Thanks for your help.

 

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[NOLA_Ken]

The base reminds me of a Russian 7.62 x 54 but that's not what you have. What is the diameter inside the shell?

 

[OutBack Duo]

Inside diameter is 1cm.

Here is another picture of it standing up next to a nickel

 

[NOLA_Ken]

I think what you have is actually a 7.62 x 54 Rifle casing that's been cut for some reason. The way the end of it curves in makes me think it was cut with a pipe cutter. I have no idea why anyone would do that though.

 

[TxMike]

I think what you have is actually a 7.62 x 54 Rifle casing that's been cut for some reason. The way the end of it curves in makes me think it was cut with a pipe cutter. I have no idea why anyone would do that though.

Unless it was used as a handy pre-set measuring device for something like a blackpowder charge for a BP pistol? The 7.62x54 was devloped in Russia in 1891 so that clearly outdates the civil war. There were some of the M91 rifles mfg'd by Remington and Westinghouse in the US for Russia during WWI. I know there were alot of surplus ones available in the 20's as the 1917 Revolution halted importation of them from America. There has been a ton of M91 and M91/30's rifles plus 100,000's of cases of ammo on the surplus market since the 70's. Still the best rifle you can buy for about $100.

 

[OutBack Duo]

could this be it: Morefield, Baltic, Crooks and Renner Historical Photos [email protected] :: U.S. Springfield rifles, Ammo, & Accessories. :: 58_Berdan_Musket_58_Remington_Musket_58_Berdan_Carbine_58_Musket

 

[NOLA_Ken]

could this be it: Morefield, Baltic, Crooks and Renner Historical Photos [email protected] :: U.S. Springfield rifles, Ammo, & Accessories. :: 58_Berdan_Musket_58_Remington_Musket_58_Berdan_Carbine_58_Musket

No, the rim on the base of the shell posted is beveled instead of flat, and 10mm is actually .40 cal. so far too small for a .58. Plus the way the edge is rolled in looks cut to me. I like TxMikes idea of a powder measure, it would be interesting to know how many grains it holds.....

 

[nsdq]

is it possible that it was snake shot or a blank at one time ?

 

[TxMike]

is it possible that it was snake shot or a blank at one time ?

Probably not. The 7.62x54R cartridge is Berdan primed with the exception of most sporting ammo (and that would have a modern headstamp on the base of the cartridge). This means that the primer in the back of the round is just a small cup with priming mixer in it. The anvil that the firing pin strikes against is actually built into the case primer pocket. The flame from the ignition shoots through two hole on either side of the anvil to ignite the powder. In comparison, most US and sporting cartridges are Boxer primed. This means the anvil for the primer is usually a tripod shaped piece of metal built into the primer cup and the flame for powder ignition shoots through a single hole in the center of the primer pocket. What all this means is that it is relatively easy to remove a Boxer primer through that center hole in order to reload the cartridge. It is much more difficult to remove Berdan primers. It can be done, but only the most serious reloaders would bother. Almost all would buy Boxer primed brass for the 7.62x54R. To get a better visual idea of what I am describing, check it out here: Centerfire ammunition - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[nsdq]

thanks TxMike, i am familar with that type of primer, reminds me of blanks i have used with the vfw for the m1 , they get ones with crimped neck and ones like you see in this post , but never seen one with out head stamp

 

[NOLA_Ken]

I could be way off with my idea of what the cartridge was or is, but I'm basing it off of the profile of the base and the given measurements. As to if it could have been snake shot, I don't think I've ever seen a snake shot round like that. in fact I know I haven't. That doesn't mean I've seen them all by any means though. I still think it's a Russian cartridge that was cut solely based on what I can see in the photos. Maybe someone playing with a tubing cutter, or as a powder measure......

 

[Monty]

I collect military bolt action rifles and reload my own hunting and target ammo. I own several rifles that shoot the 7.62X54 ammo. And I also have a couple of cases of military surplus ammo I use for plinking. I have never seen one of the cases that was cut off like that. I definately do think if it is a 7.62X54 case it has been cut off after firing because using a cut off version for a blank or perhaps propelling a granade, when fired it would straighten out the lip on the cut off area. That cut off end is still indented. The abruptness of the taper of the case is also a little confusing. My best guess would be that someone was trying to reshape the cartridge to fit a handgun of some kind. That is just a guess I reiterate. For future reference, measuring the end that the bullet normally is seated and the length gives us much more info than the rim measurment. Almost hundreds of rifle cartridges have almost identical rim diameters. On this particular case it would be almost impossible to positively identify it without having it in hand to give it a closer examination. Monty