.22 caliber cartridge - need exact production date ***SOLVED***

[Clay Lindsey]

All,

I have an expended copper-coated .22 caliber cartridge that I need help identifying. My initial research led me to believe that it was produced by Phoenix Metallic Cartridge Co. (1874-1891). However, recently I have found it may be a Peters product. This is the issue: All of the Peters Headstamps I have seen have a stamped "rounded" P and all of the Phoenix Headstamps I have seen have the "raised" roman-block P. This cartridge has a stamped roman-block P. A mix from both.

I need to know if this is either a late production Phoenix product or an early production Peter's product. If you would, please date the cartridge as accurately as possible. The answer (date) proves to be critical to a project I am working. Thank you so much in advance.

Clay

 

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[Broken knee]

Re: .22 caliber cartridge - need exact production date

CL, that's a tall order good luck
Broken Knee

 

[Clay Lindsey]

Re: .22 caliber cartridge - need exact production date

You all have my apologies in advance. I have researched beyond my internet access, hence, the question being posed here.

Clay

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Re: .22 caliber cartridge - need exact production date

More exact dating requires a more exact image.

Remington/Peters used the same "P" for about 100 years. How exact do you require?

 

[bravowhiskey]

Re: .22 caliber cartridge - need exact production date

Try this site. It just answered a question I had about an old "Henry" headstamp. Lots of good info.

oldammo.com

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: .22 caliber cartridge - need exact production date

Do you have a macro setting on your camera?

 

[Ramitt]

Re: .22 caliber cartridge - need exact production date

Wanting precise dating likely will require a quality photo. You need better lighting and focus.

 

[Clay Lindsey]

Re: .22 caliber cartridge - need exact production date

When I get back to the house I'll upload one. Thank you for your patience.

Clay

 

[Clay Lindsey]

Re: .22 caliber cartridge - need exact production date

Ok. Two (better) pictures. One of the headstamp next to a Winchester Super X .22. The other from the side. Both show the Roman-Type Style "P" really well.

Thank you for your patience.

Clay

 

[Breezie]

Re: .22 caliber cartridge - need exact production date

Doesn't yours look like this? If so, it's Peters Cartridge Co. No, wait, it's a LIPSTICK tube! (Just kidding, long story) Welcome to the forum. Breezie

 

[Clay Lindsey]

Re: .22 caliber cartridge - need exact production date

That would be the one... Do you have the production year, by chance?

No... its a BULLET! I read that thread as well. Didn't have to soak this one in hot water though. Thanks Breezie.

Clay

 

[Breezie]

Re: .22 caliber cartridge - need exact production date

That would be the one... Do you have the production year, by chance?

No... its a BULLET! I read that thread as well. Didn't have to soak this one in hot water though. Thanks Breezie.

Clay

I don't think it is possible to put an exact date on this shell. Peters Cartridge Corp. was founded in 1887, and was purchased by Remington in 1934.

Glad you didn't have to boil it in hot water! Breezie

 

[EDDE]

Re: .22 caliber cartridge - need exact production date

1887-1934

 

[Clay Lindsey]

Re: .22 caliber cartridge - need exact production date

So it would be possible Remington did change the styling of the "P" after the purchase of Peters to what we commonly see in the later 1900's. Cool. I believe I have the best answer for the buck. Thanks to all of you.

Clay

 

[turtlefoot13]

There is a chance that it is post 1934 as the Peters "P" logo was used after it combined with Rem-UMC.

Here is a link showing a Peters box with the Dupont logo.

http://myfolderz.com/Ammo/images/Peters_POLICE_Match_22_LR_Circle_P-2_jpg.jpg

Here is also another link showing a box of Peters ammo with the warning label, which was required after 1962 (image is not mine and is fuzzy).

http://myfolderz.com/Ammo/images/Peters_High_Velocity_22_Short_jpg.jpg

Hope that this helps.
Doug

 

[Clay Lindsey]

Doug,

Thank you for your input. I took your photo of the .22 shorts and converted it to black and white. Sometimes that takes the "shine" off of the metal. I then coupled it with a photo of the Remington "U" headstamp. In some instances, Remington put their headstamp on products marketed by companies they had bought out. In this case, Peter's. Using Breezie's lead, I contacted a guy that works in the Remington Corporate Historical Department (I didn't know they had one?). He is trying to help me zero in on the exact production date and maybe even help me clarify the weapon it was fired from based on the "circular" firing pin impression and date range of the ammo. Very fun and exciting stuff! Of course, that's a good idea for a new "What is it?" thread. Thanks bunches.

Clay

 

[eyemustdigtreasure]

I agree its Peters, looks just like the one I recovered today.

Here's what a (40 cal?) PHOENIX rimfire shell looks like.
- the "P" is more compact, while yours, the "P" is more squatty, elongated?