Large Livery Button with Griffin (Cleaning in Progress)

[Erik in NJ]

I thought I'd take a shot at cleaning this Livery Button since it seemed relatively toasted. I remember reading an article about someone having success with neat vinegar and it has worked well for me on a couple other items in the past. After about 45 minutes I couldn't believe the detail starting to come through. It's now been in the vinegar for several hours and most of the griffin is visible and I'm starting to see text on the back of the button.

The griffin has two out-stretched claws and is standing (sitting?) on a roped bar. You can even see its hooked tail, tongue, two ears, and beak pretty clearly. Both wings are showing now.

On the back I can see what looks like 153 Strand London. Is this enough for anyone to ID it for me. Based on how much detail was revealed, I think it's going back into a neat vinegar bath

I've attached the before and after pics below.

 

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[tngirl]

I will have to try that - I can't believe how well it's working. Sorry I can't help ID it, but it is a really neat looking button.

 

[Erik in NJ]

Hi TNGirl, I let the button soak overnight and all of the green is gone from the obverse revealing the entire griffin. Most of the green is gone from the reverse revealing more of the backmark. I figure one more good soak should do it and then I'll apply a coat of pure bees wax to try and bring out the detail. I can't believe how well it cleaned up from where it was! Best, Erik

 

[Moonrover]

I'm probably asking one of the dumbest questions ever, but what is "neat vinegar"? Different than common store bought cooking vinegar? Is it stronger?

M

 

[Erik in NJ]

Sorry for the confusion--by "neat" I meant straight or undiluted with water (or anything else). I just used regular store bought white vinegar. It seems to work very well--basically dissolves the heavy green oxidation that was all over this button. Boiling hydrogen peroxide removes the dirt but leaves the green oxidation intact. I think by the next soaking I will have the full backmark revealed. Will post another pic soon.

 

[oldsalty19]

 

[CRUSADER]

Button Makers and their backmarks - ukdfd

Search this for the backmark. Probably Firmin & ? as they were at that address in London.

I have seen this type, it is clearly a Griffin cut off at its middle by the 'rope' (forget the technical name).

 

[Erik in NJ]

Thanks for the link. The button is cleaning up quite well based on it's original condition, no?

 

[CRUSADER]

Thanks for the link. The button is cleaning up quite well based on it's original condition, no?

 

[TENNESSEEGAL]

WOW! It looks amazing! I cant believe the detail that is coming out! what an awesome find!

 

[Erik in NJ]

Thanks TN Gal! Wait till the next round of scans....it's still soaking in vinegar and looks like an entirely different button now. The backmark is fully visible and the detail on the griffin is amazing. I just got some pure bees wax and once it's done I'm going to rub a bit of wax on it to try and bring out the details. Stay tuned....

Best, Erik

 

[TENNESSEEGAL]

http://www.sheshen-eceni.co.uk/buttons.html


There is a button listed on this page that I think could be your button. Fourth down on the left Take a look for yourself. I'm no expert. Lol

 

[TENNESSEEGAL]

Thanks TN Gal! Wait till the next round of scans....it's still soaking in vinegar and looks like an entirely different button now. The backmark is fully visible and the detail on the griffin is amazing. I just got some pure bees wax and once it's done I'm going to rub a bit of wax on it to try and bring out the details. Stay tuned....

Best, Erik

I can't wait!

 

[Erik in NJ]

Hi TN Gal,

Thanks for posting the link! That's the same motif, but it's definitely a different button. That one could be a bit older as the griffin is more primitive looking than mine. I understand that a griffin was typically depicted on English livery buttons for some reason, so i'm sure there are lots of different types out there. I think I'm done soaking it in vinegar as no more debris seems to be coming off. I'll apply the bees wax tonight and repost it.

Sheshen Eceni: Buttons Gallery


There is a button listed on this page that I think could be your button. Fourth down on the left Take a look for yourself. I'm no expert. Lol

 

[Tnmountains]

Whwn you can post a pic so we can see the after shots. Thanks!